chart stalkers

Morning!

Chrissy - looks like your temp has come down at the end of AF, which is quite common. Lots of women have high temps at the beginning of the cycle, which then drop as AF finishes. The thing about a cold is that unlike a fever, it isn't necessarily accompanied by high temps. Also, if you have a cold, you're more likely to be sleeping with your mouth open - which will give you a lower reading. Best not to worry too much about it, but to make sure you note 'cold' in the FF notes - add it as a custom sign if you want to make it really clear.

NickyB - welcome! It's definitely a confusing chart. The cold temps in the bedroom will make a difference, but I'm not sure how much. The thing that's really confusing, however, is that you have two temp shifts - there's the one at CD22 as well, and the temps are high for 3 days, so it's not a one-off. But that's when you say the bedroom was cold... The other thing is that there are only 7 temps under the coverline, less than a quarter of the pre-(FF)O temps, which doesn't make sense. How regular are you normally? And what was your range of temps last cycle?

I'm going to stick my neck out here - I'm not convinced by the 29dpo ov, though I wouldn't rule it out. I think it's more likely that you ov'ed on eitherCD22, or CD27. If CD22, I think you should be expecting AF in the next couple of days. Looks to me like you may have had a dip at 4/5 dpo (quite usual - not an implantation dip) - there are several charts showing a dip below the coverline at 4/5 dpo, then rising again above it. Personally, I'd draw the coverline a little lower, at 36.1 or 36.05. If CD22, you'd be 14dpo, and looks like your temps are coming down for the end of the cycle :hug: . If CD27, you'd be 8dpo - there'd still be an outside chance, as you bd'ed on CD25. The FF coverline is fairly arbitrary - take out the C CM on CD29, and I bet the coverline would shift downwards a little and the crosshairs would move back a couple of days.

The other possibility is that you still haven't ov'ed, and/or that the cycle is annovulatory. If you discarded the temps that you say were taken when the room was cold, and drew a line from CD19 (can't work out if that was an affected temp or not) to CD28, it wouldn't be obvious at all that you'd ov'ed.

What happens if you take the CM out of the FF chart? Problem is, CM is probably the most difficult fertility sign to chart correctly because you may not always notice it, even if you're looking, and you may not categorise it 'correctly' or even consistently.

Sorry - I know this doesn't help much :hug: I guess you ought to go with the later possibility of CD27, but don't be too surprised if AF arrives in the next couple of days :hug: Of course, I hope for your sake it doesn't come at all, and there's definitely a chance with both dates. I'd definitely second the suggestion of OPKs next cycle though, it's good to have as much help as possible!
 
And now - excuse me whilst I have a little rant!

My temp went way up today! It's not supposed to do that... :evil: and because of that, FF had me ovulating on CD13. If so, it would be the shortest cycle of my entire life - I've never had one under 30 days. Plus, it would mean I'd have ovulated, then had an oestrogen rise (detected by the CBEFM). Clearly not very likely. So I've had to discard the temp for today, to avoid crosshairs... When I changed the detection method, it had me ov'ing on CD9 - even less likely, given stats, CM and CBEFM. So I'm peed off. Bad chart! The problem was that DH forgot to open the bedroom window last night and I woke up at 4 so stuffy I couldn't breathe, went to the loo, lay awake for half an hour, drifted off, and woke again at 5 because I couldn't breathe. That's when I took my temp and realised the bloody window was closed. So I think that affected the temp :x But as DH is away overnight with work, and had to leave at 6.30, we had to get in a quick BD at 5.30am (lucky he doesn't take long, eh?!) and I couldn't go back to :sleep: and temp later :doh:

I'm wondering about changing the early EWCM to C - what do you all think I should do? I know that it's defined as EWCM because it was stretching more than an inch - but from CD12 it was 3", and last night it was 6" plus (sorry about this - actually it made me feel really squeamish and :puke: ! I really don't like doing these inspections of myself!!) Surely it would be better to distinguish between the different kinds of EWCM, and just label the stuff under 3" as C? I'm sure that's what I did last cycle, thinking that it counted as 'slightly stretchy'. I feel like I'm lying to FF though, if I don't play by its rules! :rotfl:
 
Kitty are you sure you havent ovulated - your temps look like you could have even without todays......... and thats loads of EWCM lady..... Are you drinking that pineapple juice? You can ovulate at different times in a cycle its just your LP that stays the same isnt it???? Anyway you look as if you have the bases covered with the Bedding anyway :D
 
thanks Kittykins

I never thought about it being a dip because AF finished yesterday!! silly me. And my nose was really bloked last night and I kept DH awake all night with my snoring so I was definatley sleeping with my mouth open!
 
ROM - I'm very sure! Not sure what you see when you click on my link - can you see the CBEFM and OPK lines? CBEFM was Low on days 9-12, High on days 13-16 (I'm on 16 now). Last cycle, the CBEFM was Low on days 9-12, High on days 13-16 and Peak on 17-18. The previous cycle, I had High on 14-18, Peak 19-20. i'm expecting the CBEFM to give me a Peak tomorrow. I've also used OPKs (just for fun!) and they're negative.

Last month, FF tried giving me early crosshairs, too, saying I'd ov'ed on CD9 and then again later, on CD14.

Here's the chart overlay (though it doesn't show today's temp, as it's discarded temporarily):

chartoverlay2.jpg


Looks like I'm developing a little habit of troughs and peaks - don't the charts look quite similar?

As for the EWCM - last month I recorded CCM from days 8-15, EWCM from 16-18. The CCM before ov, I recorded as 'slightly stretchy - about an inch or so' and 'even stretchier today' in my notebook, the CCM after ov wasn't at all stretchy - definitely more like a blob of hand lotion (EWCM in my notebook for last cycle is recorded as >5"). So I guess I haven't been recording it consistently - either I should go back to last cycle, and change all the >1" CCM to EWCM, or I should just record all <3" or so as CCM, even though that doesn't fit with the FF definition. If I changed the CM records, then the pattern would be almost exactly the same this cycle - only one day different.


What do you think?

oh - and no, no pineapple juice for me, far too sweet! I have had some grapefruit juice on a couple of days, but only because the shop had run out of orange juice, I always have a glass of juice with breakfast. And I have had natural yoghurt every day, but then I've done so every day for the past 4 or 5 years, so don't think that affects anything!
 
Hi all,

Kitty I don't see a problem with changing the EWCM to creamy. I have been wondering the same thing myself. It's not like you are going to miss the real stuff when you see it :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:

I've noticed that if I check externally it's creamy but if I check internally then I get the half-arsed EWCM (slightly stretchy and whitish). So I think maybe I will also change back to c cm. Hmmm. How lovely this all is.

Alright, well I'm not going anywhere fast. I seem to remember being the first one to get AF this cycle, and I still haven't Oed yet :(

Sorry - just had to do a little whineging.
:shhh:
 
Corr Kitty your charts are similar - I've just had to check mine and pre ov they are all over the place!! I think you know your body best - FF always turns my lines to dashed ones when I add watery or eggwhite cm after ovulation but I know when I ovulate give or take a day due to the ov pain I feel.

Just want someone to ov early with me :( watch now I've jinxed it and I wont ov till CD43 or something!!!

I was reading something the other day that said some women's bodies have several attempts to ovulate - they build up and then no and then build up again. Corr its so confusing.

:wall: :wall: :wall:

On a lighter note my DH is all of a sudden interested in my charts - he took a look this morning and said dont you think we sould just slip in a quick one incase!!! :rotfl: Think I prefer it when he didnt take any notice....... Thank god he's gone off to work now to leave me to obsess in peace.
 
ROM- several attempts to O seems to be what my body does. I had that temp dip and then rise, and my cervix was far higher than it is now. I had fairly strong OPKs and then nothing! All around 10DPO. Now my OPKs are barely showing anything at all. It seems to be that my body tries to O too early, fails and then starts over. I am expecting to O in a week or so.

Let's see if I am right :think:

Kitty - I agree that you should just be consistent. Chart it as cm in both months. You will know when you O for sure.
 
Evening all

sookie I hope your cycle sorts itself out soon. Is it possible that you might be Oving more than once in a cycle? Or do you temps rule that out? :D

ROM I have to text DH with my temperature everyday so he can obsess over it all day :roll: :D

I have a few questions ladies, although they aren't really charting related. For the last couple of days I have been increasingly bloated, I now have a small bump which is tender to the touch. I am not constipated and am currently eating a horrendously healthy diet. 7DPO is surely way to early for this being a pregnancy symptom, right?
 
Hey all,

Wow, lots to take in tonight.

The subject of several attempts to ov is an interesting one because that's happened to me the last 2 months. Once again my body looks as though it's gearing up to ovulate at my usual time of day 18/19 as I have lots of EWCM. Everybody keep your fingers crossed for me that it does happen then and not later on in my cycle, I can't bear the thought of a long cycle again this month.
 
Kittykins, many thanks for putting so much into that reply! I've been really regular at OV-ing on day 20/21 for nearly the last year (that I've been noting in the calendar) with the exception of the miscarriage period.

Thanks everyone! I'm just going to sit it out, I was having a funny night last night! :)
 
hi all,

I've been playing with my chart :roll: and have changed the EWCMs to CCM - as Sookie says, I can tell the difference between the non-fertile EWCM and the fertile stuff, so I might as well make that difference clear on the chart! I also played around with the next few days, just to see what would happen. Strangely, if I stick a Peak on the CBEFM tomorrow, and keep the temp the same as today's, FF removes the crosshairs and says it can't tell any more... so a Peak reading clearly outweighs the temp rise of the previous days, though a High doesn't. I'd love to know how that software is set up, what the parameters are for each fertility sign, and what percentage significance is attached to each... ok, I'm a geek!

NickyB - you're very welcome! Don't worry, we all have funny nights! I'm still inclined to go for the CD22 date, but of course, if you didn't get AF in a couple of days, it would be difficult to say whether a negative HPT would be because you didn't get pg, or because you ov'ed later and therefore tested too early, or because you hadn't ovulated - so I'd wait another week or so, see what the temps do, and if you haven't got AF by then, test then... :hug:


It's not possible to actually ovulate more than once per cycle - but it's definitely possible for your body to try to ov more than once. So you can get multiple positive OPKs and multiple patches of fertile CM (especially common with PCOS), but you wouldn't get more than one temperature shift, with maintained elevated temps, because it is the release of the egg that causes the body to produce the progesterone that results in the higher temps.

Sookie - do you have PCOS? I can't remember if you've said so before - sorry! Was the u/s scan you had the other day of your ovaries? And did you ask about your long cycles? really hope it gets sorted - have you started the agnus castus yet or not?

Mildly - nothing is too early to be a pregnancy symptom on this forum :rotfl: Last cycle, I've recorded 'bloated' from 2dpo, and nausea from 4dpo. I was seriously bloated, too - my usual jeans are a UK size 8, I couldn't fit into my 'fat' jeans which are a big 10. I wore skirts pretty much every day after oving last month - and I know for sure that doesn't happen every month. Even DH noticed - I normally have a totally flat stomach, because I put fat on my thighs, never my middle, but last month I looked like I'd eaten a football. And I don't normally throw up in the supermarket loos whilst doing the weekly shop - I did that at about 10dpo. Way too early to be a pregnancy symptom...

For those who are interested, I did a search of some medical periodicals last month on early pregnancy symptoms (I have access to academic databases, so you can search all journals by keywords) and apparently although HCG is produced only after implantation, the fertilised egg produces a different hormone before implantation. It's thought that the presence of this hormone may well cause very early symptoms, but of course, technically, the woman would not be pregnant at this stage because the egg wouldn't be implanted. A couple of the papers I read suggested that the reseach could be used commercially, to develop even earlier pregnancy tests that could be used as early as 2 days after ovulation. Of course, the problem is that a large number of fertilised eggs don't implant successfully, so a test to detect fertilisation is pretty much useless to the average woman. It would result in 'chemical fertilisations' as well as chemical pregnancies. The medical use would be that it would at least show whether or not the sperm was capable of fertilising the egg. Anyway, looks like they're a couple of years off commercialising the process, and that there are too many ethical issues to make it viable for home use. But it might well explain so many of the phantom pregnancy symptoms we all experience, and also the fact that so many women 'just know' well before a HPT could give a reliable result.



Phew, that was a really long one, sorry.

Well, I'm off to bed now - DH is away tonight, so I'm looking forward to a peaceful, uninterrupted night's sleep. It'll be interesting to see whether tomorrow's temp will be lower, given his hot sweaty radiator of a body won't be in the bed, or higher, because I'll (hopefully) have had a decent stretch of sleep!
 
That is such an interesting and helpful post Kittykins, thank you!
 
CB23 - you're very welcome! :D


I got another High today :( I was expecting a Peak today, tomorrow or Sunday, so I'm not particularly worried yet, but I've switched the chart back to advanced, and FF makes me 3dpo. Still, today's data means that FF moved the CH another day later, so clearly it's not that sure!

Of course, I've now started wondering whether it's possible that I can ovulate without the CBEFM detecting the surge... even though the website says that most women experience 1-5 Highs before the Peak, and I had 4 Highs last month, and 5 the previous month, so this month's 5 Highs aren't exactly unusual. This exact same thing happened last cycle too, with FF giving me early CH, and me getting upset that we'd missed the O day. And FF still has my fertile days on the stats line as tomorrow, Sunday and Monday... I think that I should stop entering details on FF until after I get a Peak reading, I get so stressed by the FF interpretation! Excuse me whilst I scream!
 
Morning all and isnt it a beautiful day - well it is here in shropshire :D

Kitty have you tried changing your FF to the fertility awareness method? I think that goes by + opk as well as temps and cm? Just a thought. To be honest I think we know our bodies best and if you are confident of the pattern on your CBEFM then I would work from that.

FF is telling me I am possibly fertile today but I know I'm not - need to see 3 or 4 days of watery CM and then my temp shifts usually....Thats what I look out for........

Anyway try not to stress yourself you look as though you have the Bedding well covered this month :D
 
Hi ROM,

Changing to Fertility Awareness makes me 4dpo, with a low chance of conception (BD on O-3 and O+1). Advanced gives me 3dpo, with a good chance (BD on O). Research and OPK/Monitor both say I haven't O'd yet. Who knows?!

I've had only 2 cycles on the CBEFM, which isn't really enough to be absolutely sure, though they were both very similar. But last cycle's chem may have messed up my hormones a bit, I don't know. The only real signs I know about are that I usually have an increased sex drive mid-cycle, which since I started charting has coincided with the 2 or 3 days around ov, and I usually get cramps a day or two after ov - I've had nothing yet this cycle. If the discomfort/relative comfort experienced during BDing is indeed a fertility sign for me, I definitely haven't ov'ed yet - it's been very uncomfortable! Actually, think I might add that as a custom sign on FF... :rotfl:

I think the main reason that I'm peed off is because I'm a control freak and I don't like my plans to be upset :x Having moved the planned visit to my parents from this coming weekend to last weekend in order to optimise the BD timing, I'll be so annoyed if it turns out we should have spent last weekend at home in bed! Plus I've organised lots of nice things for this weekend, starting with dinner at Pont de la Tour tonight... :lol:

Anyway, I shouldn't think about it any more - I have a document I need to research, write and send off by the end of this afternoon, so I'd better get back to work!
 
Oh Kitty Pont de la Tour looks wonderful - their menu is making my mouth water..... My DH gets about a lot in London to most of the best restaurants and hotels (he owns a company that makes ice sculptures) I'll ask him about it tonight - we are hoping to grab a night down there before Christmas - went to the Landmark last year but that menu looks so nice.....

Trying not to think about it is easier said than done hey! I am supposed to be interviewing two candidates this afternoon before I take my son to the hospital and I think I have left it too late now having spent too much time looking for private fertility clinics in the Midlands!!!

What is your line of work? I was beginning to be convinced you were a medical doctor but now I'm not so sure.

Jane
 
see, I couldn't keep away! :rotfl:

Pont de la Tour is where DH proposed - it is good food, but the connections make it even better for getting in the mood :wink: ROM, I hope that if you're planning a night away, you're checking those dates! No worrying about the teenager in the bedroom next door :lol:

I'm an academic researcher - I've been teaching at universities for the past three years on fixed-term contracts, now taking a year off teaching to get my thesis and other research published, and hope to get a permanent post for the next academic year. That doesn't fit very well with TTC (if I got pg this cycle, it would be due in August :lol: ), but there's no point worrying about something until it happens, and things tend to sort themselves out! I had an early mid-life crisis - used to be an accountant :roll:

My biggest problem is I love researching stuff, and analysing the findings - I'd research the backs of cornflake packets if I thought anyone would be interested in an interpretation of the results! But it means I get very easily distracted :x - I keep trying to find out more :rotfl: And then I write a thesis on it and post it on here! :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:

What do you do, ROM? What does everyone else do? I know Sookie's a teacher...
 
I also had a midlife crisis :rotfl: worked as a HR Mananger for 20 + years then took a redundancy package and set up a juice and smoothie bar!!! Sold it after 2 years - just didnt have a life at all and DH works silly hours in the evenings and weekends so we just didnt see each other at all and so got back into what I know best and set up my own recruitment agency in September. Problem is I find myself wandering onto the internet to read up on TTC!!! Actually it works well for me as most of my business is done on the phone and I can work from home or on my travels so get to see loads more of Dave.....

Its great that you are doing a job that enables you to enjoy yourself.... I have to admit you do seem to understand the workings of FF like no one else I have spoken to... :D

I do tend to over analysis things myself - if I have decided to do something then I will research it within an inch of its life - that's why I am finding this TTC thing so hard to handle - it seems that however much you know you just cant make it happen!! When we book a holiday I get more pleasure from the planning and researching part than I do the going!! Drives Dave mad :rotfl: I will have found out every restaurant, trip, good points and bad points before we have even got on the plane...

Come on ladies what does everyone else do???
 
:rotfl: no wonder you are good at our charts kittykins
Im a nurse, i used to work full time in a childrens surgical ward but i left when i had my daughter then fell pregnant with my other daughter when i was still on mat leave :rotfl: so i just do shifts now and again, when i can be bothered :roll: now that the kids are in nursery in the afternoons i am getting so lazy
 

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