can you actually afford to have a baby?

[LikeJohnnYoko]

The system is totally flawed here too. It's too easy to fraud and not work

Yet, if you're a legitimate claimant, it's stressful, anxiety-inducing, confusing and down right upsetting. The difference is that people who need it are scared of being left without it, it takes a toll on their mind and health and yet the *******s who con the system and give legitimate claimants a bad name have no such worries. All and any crack downs tend to affect a disproportionate amount of legitimate claimants rather than the actual crooks.

It's not fair is it? It's never the ones who are defrauding the system that get hit.

 

[tinytoes]

It's disgraceful , that people face such stress and upset when they have a ligutemate claim

 

[CARNAT22]

I agree that benefits should be a last resort, not a lifestyle choice but I do think this country is fucked up when it comes to SMP and working mothers.

My SIL had to make the difficult decision not to go back to work after mat leave as she would be worse off once the cost of childcare was factored in.

Luckily they can afford for her to have some more time out of employment with my brothers salary (effectively they are just cutting out childcare costs!)

We may have to do the same, or even more drastically I may go back to work and OH will have to be a stay at home Dad [maybe working part time and we'll rely on family to help us out!]

We've managed to save a reasonable amount BUT once I go onto SMP - which reduces my monthly salary by 3/4's - we'll be needing about £6k of our savings to just live.

We'll have to put off moving to a bigger place until we can afford it.

It makes me sick that I've been to uni, worked since I was 21 and will break my back to be able to support my baby when other people can simply choose not to work and be on benefits??

The disparity between entitlements for middle / low earners that want to provide for their own family and those on benefits is astounding.

My friend has two kids, her BF doesn't live with them so she is a "single Mum" on benefits and just got moved to a massive 2 bedroom council house which she pays about £10 a week for?

I mean how is that fair....

xxxxxxxxxxx

 

[cosmicgirl]

It's not fair.
Working parents are penalised and it doesnt help families or the economy one bit.
It makes more sense to me to help parents to work and get them paying tax and contributing to society in return???
I'm not a politician so what do I know x

 

[Tara1985]

I love a debate and have enjoyed reading everyone's opinions but I'm just getting upset reading the thread!!! The SYSTEM is to blame!!!

There is a flip side to people on benefits too. My mother was on benefits raising three children, because our A-hole dad left her. She attempted to work several times during the course of my childhood and she was stung BIG time everytime. It was like she was penalised for trying.

How can a parent on minimum wage raise a child and pay for everything? Yes benefits are a stop gap but the difference between minimum wage and cost of living is so huge I actually don't blame people for remaining on benefits. Something needs to give....but like Cos said I'm no politician either and possibly ignorant to what the country is capable of financially. I guess we can all agree the system is not fair on both sides to a certain extent.

Oh and by the way I can not afford my child but I will make do without benefits because I have no choice. I earn too much to be entitled to anything. I could sell my property and leave my partner and then seek assistance but why would I do that? We just have to make sacrifices. I will shop for fruit and veg at the market instead of supermarket, have sold my car, will not have a holiday for a long time. New clothes? Not for a long while. I don't care because I will have my precious family.

I am not angry with people on benefits trying to better themselves. I also don't think people on the thread are attacking just debating. I am mainly frustrated with the government regarding child care costs. The cost of living is increased meaning both parents have to work but then you are left with nothing at the end of the month unless you earn above a certain salary bracket

xxx

 

[littlemiss83]

I agree.

People should defo not be TTC when they dont have an income, but I also think that there is too many ppl who TTC, while having a job, then leave through pregnancy or soon after baby is born, or when they are due to return after leave - with no source of income apart from benefits, this is also irresponsible as it shows to me that the decision to TTC hasn't been well thought out. Its obvious working when pregnant is hard, its obvious having a baby and working is hard. I understand if there is severe complications thro childbirth meaning a few extra months off. But very often I hear......I just cant leave my baby now, even though i've arranged to go back to work, i'll just go on benefits as its easier, or......oh I didn't realise how much childcare was.....hmmmmmmmmmm - thats my response. Planning for a baby means planning these things, checking on how much your money will change, who will watch LO can you afford nursery. Fact is - ppl dont care they really dont, as long as they get money they dont care where its from.

I do think that benefits are good to fall back on & i'm glad they are about for ppl who are in trouble.

Also - I think there is a fine line when it comes to TTC & not TTC. For example, someone wants a baby but has no means to support, and dont want to say - im TTC so instead its an "accident" I know that accidents do happen - but alot of the time its because people aren't that bothered. For example, if there was absolutely no benefits system to fall back on, would there still be the same amount of "accidents" or would people try a bit harder??

And I agree 100% with what cosmic said - Why should I go out working a full time job,missing out on stuff with my child, while my neighbour gets to lounge about, doing nothing, claiming benefits.

I think ppl need to wake up and smell the coffee, there might not be many ppl on PF that falls into these categorys, but threre sure is loads of them around the UK.

There are 3 reasons that the whole issue needs alot of thought (turning to benefits for help with baby)

A) - the benefits system is changing....rapidly - there is already plans in place to cut housing benefit for those under the age of 30 - including those with children.

B) there is stricter rules for benefits claimants now & they are cracking down on other parts of it. And you never know when benefits will stop altogether lets not forget how much our benefits/NHS is being more americanised. What the heck is gonna happen with all these girls on benefits when/if we end up like America & there is no benefits at all.

and

C) - your child will find out that you have relyed on the state for money when they are older & they will in turn think its ok not to work.

There is a girl I know, she's a single mother, with a 5 y/o. She is now pregnant with her 2nd, she is on full benefits & has never been in a relationship with the father, not only did she deliberatly fall pregnant just to have babies, she also doesn't have any way to support. She's just back from a 7 week holiday through all the school holidays while I didn't get one weekend away - oh and she doesn't need to worry about being a single mother either coz her mummy & daddy will do everything for her as they do just now.

 

[MrsR]

The system is totally flawed here too. It's too easy to fraud and not work

Yet, if you're a legitimate claimant, it's stressful, anxiety-inducing, confusing and down right upsetting. The difference is that people who need it are scared of being left without it, it takes a toll on their mind and health and yet the *******s who con the system and give legitimate claimants a bad name have no such worries. All and any crack downs tend to affect a disproportionate amount of legitimate claimants rather than the actual crooks.

It's not fair is it? It's never the ones who are defrauding the system that get hit.

This!

When DH lost his job due to lack of work available we had to have help to fill out the right firms because it was so confusing! I have no idea how people con and defraud the system, I barely understand it! We know that benefits are just a stop gap for us as we really want to work, but it's so demoralising when I know several families with about 6 children each who laugh at the system and brag about not working!

 

[cosmicgirl]

The system is totally flawed here too. It's too easy to fraud and not work

Yet, if you're a legitimate claimant, it's stressful, anxiety-inducing, confusing and down right upsetting. The difference is that people who need it are scared of being left without it, it takes a toll on their mind and health and yet the *******s who con the system and give legitimate claimants a bad name have no such worries. All and any crack downs tend to affect a disproportionate amount of legitimate claimants rather than the actual crooks.

It's not fair is it? It's never the ones who are defrauding the system that get hit.

This!

When DH lost his job due to lack of work available we had to have help to fill out the right firms because it was so confusing! I have no idea how people con and defraud the system, I barely understand it! We know that benefits are just a stop gap for us as we really want to work, but it's so demoralising when I know several families with about 6 children each who laugh at the system and brag about not working!

Exactly, for me with 5 children there is no financial incentive for me to work. I could be a lot better off on benefits and that is plain wrong.
There is a lady by me who has 9 kids and has no (and never has had) any intention to work.
I said to her one day "god, I bet your kids cost a fortune to feed, mine eat like horses"
" no, I get loads of money each week because I've got so many, I'm not a mug working every day when I can just keep having kids".
She then asked "don't you get loads too?"
I told her no, I work and pay for all of mine.
"more fool you" she said.
Maybe she's right? Maybe these people have got the right idea?? I mean they get to watch their children grow up don't they? x

 

[LikeJohnnYoko]

The system is totally flawed here too. It's too easy to fraud and not work

Yet, if you're a legitimate claimant, it's stressful, anxiety-inducing, confusing and down right upsetting. The difference is that people who need it are scared of being left without it, it takes a toll on their mind and health and yet the *******s who con the system and give legitimate claimants a bad name have no such worries. All and any crack downs tend to affect a disproportionate amount of legitimate claimants rather than the actual crooks.

It's not fair is it? It's never the ones who are defrauding the system that get hit.

This!

When DH lost his job due to lack of work available we had to have help to fill out the right firms because it was so confusing! I have no idea how people con and defraud the system, I barely understand it! We know that benefits are just a stop gap for us as we really want to work, but it's so demoralising when I know several families with about 6 children each who laugh at the system and brag about not working!

Exactly, for me with 5 children there is no financial incentive for me to work. I could be a lot better off on benefits and that is plain wrong.
There is a lady by me who has 9 kids and has no (and never has had) any intention to work.
I said to her one day "god, I bet your kids cost a fortune to feed, mine eat like horses"
" no, I get loads of money each week because I've got so many, I'm not a mug working every day when I can just keep having kids".
She then asked "don't you get loads too?"
I told her no, I work and pay for all of mine.
"more fool you" she said.
Maybe she's right? Maybe these people have got the right idea?? I mean they get to watch their children grow up don't they? x

But that's the thing - they may watch their children grow up, but what do they instil into them? There's no incentive for the children of career benefit claimants to do well at school, have hobbies/interests or have any kind of work ethic.

I once had a chat with some girls in a shop about their aspirations. They came from a local estate and their parents and grandparents were all on benefits/had never worked. I asked them about what they wanted from life and was met with "There's no point trying." I felt so sad for them.

I'm the daughter of someone who had to claim benefits to survive. Seeing how it affected her, I cannot understand the mentality of people who choose a life on the State.

 

[Happyfeet]

My Husband was working on a farm for years, earning good money - we could afford plenty of extras and lovely things for our children without thinking about it. Then the farm went bankrupt, and he no longer had a job. He had to sign on to JSA for a short while, let me tell you, he felt so ashamed going into that job centre to basically ask for money.

He then got a job that pays minimum wage, it's not glamorous, it leaves him in agony as he has fibromyalgia and this is a physical job, we don't have a lot spare but he does it because it was the first job he was offered, he wants to provide for our family and he just can't sit around doing nothing all day. When he could just get himself signed off and sit on ESA.

Do I think we can afford our children and impending arrival? Absolutely, we might not have thousands in the bank, or big holidays but we get by. Our children are all loved, cuddled, fed, safe, have good manners and have everything they need.

I can't believe that people earning minimum wage and having families has come into question on this thread! Without minimum wage workers, the country literally wouldn't keep going! Somebody has to do the job! What a ludicrous statement, whatever way it's dressed up, it's an awful thing to say.

 

[Tara1985]

I can't believe that people earning minimum wage and having families has come into question on this thread! Without minimum wage workers, the country literally wouldn't keep going! Somebody has to do the job! What a ludicrous statement, whatever way it's dressed up, it's an awful thing to say.

For clarity, it was certainly not my intention to question people on minimum wages. You are right, jobs and skill set vary so the salary is reflected by this.

What I find frustrating is the cost of living which is another topic I was trying to relate it to my mother. When she tried to work, she would be on the minimum wage but a large proportion of her benefits would be cut meaning she could not afford rent etc. This is what I meant by the flip side (negative) of benefits. My mother was penalised for attempting to work but as her benefits were cut so drastically the minimum wage didn't cut it meaning she always had to go back on benefits. It s vicious cycle.....sorry for the waffle. I have pregnancy brains

xxx

 

[cosmicgirl]

My Husband was working on a farm for years, earning good money - we could afford plenty of extras and lovely things for our children without thinking about it. Then the farm went bankrupt, and he no longer had a job. He had to sign on to JSA for a short while, let me tell you, he felt so ashamed going into that job centre to basically ask for money.

He then got a job that pays minimum wage, it's not glamorous, it leaves him in agony as he has fibromyalgia and this is a physical job, we don't have a lot spare but he does it because it was the first job he was offered, he wants to provide for our family and he just can't sit around doing nothing all day. When he could just get himself signed off and sit on ESA.

Do I think we can afford our children and impending arrival? Absolutely, we might not have thousands in the bank, or big holidays but we get by. Our children are all loved, cuddled, fed, safe, have good manners and have everything they need.

I can't believe that people earning minimum wage and having families has come into question on this thread! Without minimum wage workers, the country literally wouldn't keep going! Somebody has to do the job! What a ludicrous statement, whatever way it's dressed up, it's an awful thing to say.

The number of farmers that have lost their livelihood in recent years is so sad.
They work bloody hard and it seems that the situation is getting harder for a lot of them x

 

[Happyfeet]

I can't believe that people earning minimum wage and having families has come into question on this thread! Without minimum wage workers, the country literally wouldn't keep going! Somebody has to do the job! What a ludicrous statement, whatever way it's dressed up, it's an awful thing to say.

For clarity, it was certainly not my intention to question people on minimum wages. You are right, jobs and skill set vary so the salary is reflected by this.

What I find frustrating is the cost of living which is another topic I was trying to relate it to my mother. When she tried to work, she would be on the minimum wage but a large proportion of her benefits would be cut meaning she could not afford rent etc. This is what I meant by the flip side (negative) of benefits. My mother was penalised for attempting to work but as her benefits were cut so drastically the minimum wage didn't cut it meaning she always had to go back on benefits. It s vicious cycle.....sorry for the waffle. I have pregnancy brains

xxx

I didn't even know you had said anything, I was referring to what somebody else had said lol.

 

[Happyfeet]

My Husband was working on a farm for years, earning good money - we could afford plenty of extras and lovely things for our children without thinking about it. Then the farm went bankrupt, and he no longer had a job. He had to sign on to JSA for a short while, let me tell you, he felt so ashamed going into that job centre to basically ask for money.

He then got a job that pays minimum wage, it's not glamorous, it leaves him in agony as he has fibromyalgia and this is a physical job, we don't have a lot spare but he does it because it was the first job he was offered, he wants to provide for our family and he just can't sit around doing nothing all day. When he could just get himself signed off and sit on ESA.

Do I think we can afford our children and impending arrival? Absolutely, we might not have thousands in the bank, or big holidays but we get by. Our children are all loved, cuddled, fed, safe, have good manners and have everything they need.

I can't believe that people earning minimum wage and having families has come into question on this thread! Without minimum wage workers, the country literally wouldn't keep going! Somebody has to do the job! What a ludicrous statement, whatever way it's dressed up, it's an awful thing to say.

The number of farmers that have lost their livelihood in recent years is so sad.
They work bloody hard and it seems that the situation is getting harder for a lot of them x

Tell me about it! He used to work 115 hours some weeks, so we never really saw him, but the children knew he had been home by the smell of muck in the house where he'd taken off his pooey trousers and left them in the bathroom!

 

[Tara1985]

Hahaha ok good

 

[redbear]

this website is for ttc pregnant ladies or people with children so think this thread is useless and will just upset people. i personally care more about the care of the child than what job the parents have. there is a lot worse in the world than people *been too poor to deserve children* i whould be more worried about the state of social services. . btw me and my husband work on minimum wage and the only job he could get was miles from home so costs £200 a month in petrol so no i can't afford my babies but im a bloody good mum and i work hard but could do without people trying to dictate who should have kids.

 

[cosmicgirl]

My Husband was working on a farm for years, earning good money - we could afford plenty of extras and lovely things for our children without thinking about it. Then the farm went bankrupt, and he no longer had a job. He had to sign on to JSA for a short while, let me tell you, he felt so ashamed going into that job centre to basically ask for money.

He then got a job that pays minimum wage, it's not glamorous, it leaves him in agony as he has fibromyalgia and this is a physical job, we don't have a lot spare but he does it because it was the first job he was offered, he wants to provide for our family and he just can't sit around doing nothing all day. When he could just get himself signed off and sit on ESA.

Do I think we can afford our children and impending arrival? Absolutely, we might not have thousands in the bank, or big holidays but we get by. Our children are all loved, cuddled, fed, safe, have good manners and have everything they need.

I can't believe that people earning minimum wage and having families has come into question on this thread! Without minimum wage workers, the country literally wouldn't keep going! Somebody has to do the job! What a ludicrous statement, whatever way it's dressed up, it's an awful thing to say.

The number of farmers that have lost their livelihood in recent years is so sad.
They work bloody hard and it seems that the situation is getting harder for a lot of them x

Tell me about it! He used to work 115 hours some weeks, so we never really saw him, but the children knew he had been home by the smell of muck in the house where he'd taken off his pooey trousers and left them in the bathroom!

Hahaha I know that smell!
I worked with elephants for a year to get through college.
I couldn't smell it but my mum would go mad when I got home with the smell on my wellie boots and clothes x

 

[Happyfeet]

My Husband was working on a farm for years, earning good money - we could afford plenty of extras and lovely things for our children without thinking about it. Then the farm went bankrupt, and he no longer had a job. He had to sign on to JSA for a short while, let me tell you, he felt so ashamed going into that job centre to basically ask for money.

He then got a job that pays minimum wage, it's not glamorous, it leaves him in agony as he has fibromyalgia and this is a physical job, we don't have a lot spare but he does it because it was the first job he was offered, he wants to provide for our family and he just can't sit around doing nothing all day. When he could just get himself signed off and sit on ESA.

Do I think we can afford our children and impending arrival? Absolutely, we might not have thousands in the bank, or big holidays but we get by. Our children are all loved, cuddled, fed, safe, have good manners and have everything they need.

I can't believe that people earning minimum wage and having families has come into question on this thread! Without minimum wage workers, the country literally wouldn't keep going! Somebody has to do the job! What a ludicrous statement, whatever way it's dressed up, it's an awful thing to say.

The number of farmers that have lost their livelihood in recent years is so sad.
They work bloody hard and it seems that the situation is getting harder for a lot of them x

Tell me about it! He used to work 115 hours some weeks, so we never really saw him, but the children knew he had been home by the smell of muck in the house where he'd taken off his pooey trousers and left them in the bathroom!

Hahaha I know that smell!
I worked with elephants for a year to get through college.
I couldn't smell it but my mum would go mad when I got home with the smell on my wellie boots and clothes x

He couldn't smell it either lol! Used to walk in with all sorts in his hair, on his face etc and go in for a kiss! Eeeeew lol.

 

[cosmicgirl]

My Husband was working on a farm for years, earning good money - we could afford plenty of extras and lovely things for our children without thinking about it. Then the farm went bankrupt, and he no longer had a job. He had to sign on to JSA for a short while, let me tell you, he felt so ashamed going into that job centre to basically ask for money.

He then got a job that pays minimum wage, it's not glamorous, it leaves him in agony as he has fibromyalgia and this is a physical job, we don't have a lot spare but he does it because it was the first job he was offered, he wants to provide for our family and he just can't sit around doing nothing all day. When he could just get himself signed off and sit on ESA.

Do I think we can afford our children and impending arrival? Absolutely, we might not have thousands in the bank, or big holidays but we get by. Our children are all loved, cuddled, fed, safe, have good manners and have everything they need.

I can't believe that people earning minimum wage and having families has come into question on this thread! Without minimum wage workers, the country literally wouldn't keep going! Somebody has to do the job! What a ludicrous statement, whatever way it's dressed up, it's an awful thing to say.

The number of farmers that have lost their livelihood in recent years is so sad.
They work bloody hard and it seems that the situation is getting harder for a lot of them x

Tell me about it! He used to work 115 hours some weeks, so we never really saw him, but the children knew he had been home by the smell of muck in the house where he'd taken off his pooey trousers and left them in the bathroom!

Hahaha I know that smell!
I worked with elephants for a year to get through college.
I couldn't smell it but my mum would go mad when I got home with the smell on my wellie boots and clothes x

He couldn't smell it either lol! Used to walk in with all sorts in his hair, on his face etc and go in for a kiss! Eeeeew lol.

Hahaha at least I didn't go in for a kiss with my mum, she'll be thankful lol
I did however have a lot of people move away from me on the bus home, always got a seat though lol x

 

[Roo3]

this website is for ttc pregnant ladies or people with children so think this thread is useless and will just upset people. i personally care more about the care of the child than what job the parents have. there is a lot worse in the world than people *been too poor to deserve children* i whould be more worried about the state of social services. . btw me and my husband work on minimum wage and the only job he could get was miles from home so costs £200 a month in petrol so no i can't afford my babies but im a bloody good mum and i work hard but could do without people trying to dictate who should have kids.

I don't think anyone is dictating who should have kids. People are just saying that they are pissed off with people who have no intention to work yet are ttc with no means of supporting their children leaving it up to the tax payer to support them. Yes, the care of the child is important, but surely the care includes being able to provide for them too?
Oh and there are people using this forum who aren't ttc, wtt or have kids should they not be allowed to use the forum based on your opening sentance?