Split post re: UK going downhill

[Melly+2]

You could say the same bout easter too, i bet if you asked 100 kids what easter is a celebration of theyd have no idea

 

[Krystal]

Hi girls.

When I said before that people who have their children christened then never go to church is hypocritical someone said it was rubbish to say that. (Sorry without reading back I can't remember who)! I stand by what I said and it is my view of the way some people choose to dip in and out of religion when it suits them. I'm just saying it how I see it.

I don't want to drag any old crap up, I just wanted to speak up for myself and clear it up.

Lou

that was me

I was saying how can you possibly call me a hypocrite for getting my child christened then not going to church every sunday there after when nowhere does it state that I have to worship at a church? I don't go to church on a sunday, i don't think that makes me any less of a chirstian.
That was the point I was making!

and I'm sure now that naming ceromonies are available not many people would just choose to have their child christened just for sake of it, i know my friends who aren't christians just have naming ceremonies anyway

 

[Squiglet]

It was always that way....well the good food and gifts and being with loved ones, not the TV hehe....it was always celebrated as a winter festival, until the christians got hold of it and overlayed the traditions and myths with thier own, and then coca cola added the image of father christmas, so to me there is nothing christian about christmas anyway.

As I was saying earlier there is a lot of parallels between religions, even if the religious groups refuse to accept it...

At the end of the day... "Christmas" has never been specifically Christian holiday... Lots of religions celebrate very important holy days around this time..

One of the reasons why this happens is because all religions (including Christianity) have at some time suffered persecution from another... so in order to "blend" in with the society at large (which someone mentioned above) they placed their important dates on or around other religions holy days so that they could still celebrate their religion but not fear persecution...

Christmas, falls dangerously close to Saturnalia, a Roman festival.. We know that Romans persecuted the Christians... so in order to "fit in" with the population at large, Christmas was put in around that time. There's no where in the bible that specifically states December 25th is Jesus' birthday and the calender we go by today, was not the calender in predominate use 2000 years ago so its quite complicated to work out an exact date...

Also again Yule.. another festival falls around this time, as does Hanukkah, Jewish, Eid al-adha, Muslim and Festival of Shiva, Hindu....

They might not be on the same day... but there is something very old and ancient about celebrations in the month of December.

 

[Krystal]

omg squiglet... how the hell do you know all this stuff? you always have an in depth answer to everything my brain not big enough to cope

 

[Squiglet]

Hi girls.

When I said before that people who have their children christened then never go to church is hypocritical someone said it was rubbish to say that. (Sorry without reading back I can't remember who)! I stand by what I said and it is my view of the way some people choose to dip in and out of religion when it suits them. I'm just saying it how I see it.

I don't want to drag any old crap up, I just wanted to speak up for myself and clear it up.

Lou

that was me

I was saying how can you possibly call me a hypocrite for getting my child christened then not going to church every sunday there after when nowhere does it state that I have to worship at a church? I don't go to church on a sunday, i don't think that makes me any less of a chirstian.
That was the point I was making!

and I'm sure now that naming ceromonies are available not many people would just choose to have their child christened just for sake of it, i know my friends who aren't christians just have naming ceremonies anyway

Technically, the baptismal rights state that you make a promise to bring your child up following the teachings of Jesus Christ. As the Bible is pretty open for interpretation... then as long as you are bringing your children up in your interpretation of the word of Jesus Christ as written in the bible then you are keeping that promise right?... You're quite right, you don't HAVE to go to church to be a Christian....

 

[Squiglet]

omg squiglet... how the hell do you know all this stuff? you always have an in depth answer to everything my brain not big enough to cope

rotfl: OOO did you not read this...

http://www.pregnancyforum.co.uk/forum/v ... hp?t=53667

I get the award for sad, lonely, looser who reads too much pointless cr*p.

Plus I loved arguing with my religious ed teacher at school...

 

[Krystal]

Technically, the baptismal rights state that you make a promise to bring your child up following the teachings of Jesus Christ. As the Bible is pretty open for interpretation... then as long as you are bringing your children up in your interpretation of the word of Jesus Christ as written in the bible then you are keeping that promise right?... You're quite right, you don't HAVE to go to church to be a Christian....

exactly, but i see she has a point about certain people, i just think it could have been worded better from lou if what she means is people wh don't live by these values then get their child christened

 

[Lou]

Sorry. I'm crap at wording stuff. I'm even worse in person, I get all nervous and get my words mixed up. I did mean people who use the church but don't really believe in what the church stands for. Hope you know what I mean now.

I've learnt loads from the last few posts. Stuff I didnt know.

Lou

p.s My cold has really kicked in today and tbh I don't have the strength to argue or debate....I'm all stuffy and poorly

 

[Krystal]

Sorry. I'm crap at wording stuff. I'm even worse in person, I get all nervous and get my words mixed up. I did mean people who use the church but don't really believe in what the church stands for. Hope you know what I mean now.

I've learnt loads from the last few posts. Stuff I didnt know.

Lou

p.s My cold has really kicked in today and tbh I don't have the strength to argue or debate....I'm all stuffy and poorly

dont worry i understood you point.. aww sorry your feeling ill have some

 

[Lou]

Sorry. I'm crap at wording stuff. I'm even worse in person, I get all nervous and get my words mixed up. I did mean people who use the church but don't really believe in what the church stands for. Hope you know what I mean now.

I've learnt loads from the last few posts. Stuff I didnt know.

Lou

p.s My cold has really kicked in today and tbh I don't have the strength to argue or debate....I'm all stuffy and poorly

dont worry i understood you point.. aww sorry your feeling ill have some

thanks babe I need to go throw some zeds

 

[libs]

I can't believe I read all that and I'm a fast reader

Just to say - watch out for the "banning St George's day" etc type statements - the govt doesn't do things like that - individual shops/schools etc might - but I work for a company which gets its equal opportunity training/practice scrutinised by a govt dept and we celebrate St George's day, and Christmas and Easter etc - but we also get to celebrate loads of other festivals from other cultures.

Often these everything british is banned statements come from confused newstories. For example - last year in Stoke on trent we had a series of events organised by the local council from November to February all coming under the banner of "winterfest" - the national papers picked it up and said we had "banned" Christmas All the lights, santas, carol singing etc was right there in the programme - along with loads of other events to take us through to Spring....but that was never mentioned

BTW - grandchild of immigrants - thank god the UK has a history of helping people in need - otherwise I wouldn't be here today - and you'd all be Libs free

 

[Krystal]

For example - last year in Stoke on trent we had a series of events organised by the local council from November to February all coming under the banner of "winterfest" - the national papers picked it up and said we had "banned" Christmas All the lights, santas, carol singing etc was right there in the programme - along with loads of other events to take us through to Spring....but that was never mentioned
quote]

i remember seing this story and thinking wtf and being bit p'd off with it just goes to show, media not helping anything

 

[zebrastripes]

BTW - grandchild of immigrants - thank god the UK has a history of helping people in need - otherwise I wouldn't be here today - and you'd all be Libs free

Same here.

 

[lisa&alex]

Hi girls.



When I said before that people who have their children christened then never go to church is hypocritical someone said it was rubbish to say that. (Sorry without reading back I can't remember who)! I stand by what I said and it is my view of the way some people choose to dip in and out of religion when it suits them. I'm just saying it how I see it.

I don't want to drag any old crap up, I just wanted to speak up for myself and clear it up.

Lou

it doesnt really matter what you think about what other people do though does it? infact i find that you have been pretty judging within this thread, and yes of course you are entitled to your opinion..however have you ever thought that people do these things for family etc..

i got married in a church, im not religious. although i am openminded...and i will be getting both of my children christened.. not because of my own beliefs.. but because of my grandmothers and my husbands parents... and.. i think that you will find that that is my choice.. i shouldnt be judged by anyone else because of this.

 

[Lou]

Hi girls.



When I said before that people who have their children christened then never go to church is hypocritical someone said it was rubbish to say that. (Sorry without reading back I can't remember who)! I stand by what I said and it is my view of the way some people choose to dip in and out of religion when it suits them. I'm just saying it how I see it.

I don't want to drag any old crap up, I just wanted to speak up for myself and clear it up.

Lou

it doesnt really matter what you think about what other people do though does it? infact i find that you have been pretty judging within this thread, and yes of course you are entitled to your opinion..however have you ever thought that people do these things for family etc..

i got married in a church, im not religious. although i am openminded...and i will be getting both of my children christened.. not because of my own beliefs.. but because of my grandmothers and my husbands parents... and.. i think that you will find that that is my choice.. i shouldnt be judged by anyone else because of this.

Why doesn't it matter what I think about other people? I respect everyones views I just don't happen to agree with them. I don't like the tone of what you just said to me. My opinion is that if you get married in a church and/or get your children christened and you are not religious then you are a hypocrite. Its not a "judgment" its my opinion. Why make promises in the eyes of a god you don't believe in? Especially just to please other people? But like you say its your choice but don't get all arsey with me because you don't like my opinion. I've obviously touched a nerve with you so maybe you know it really is a bit hypocritical to use the church when it means nothing to you religiously? I can't see why else you would be so rude to me?

Lou

 

[lisa&alex]

lou..

on this forum are people from different backgrounds, cultures, races, lifestyles, etc etc etc.. i feel that by making remarks such as many you have are rude, and thats just my opinion.. when you are part of a group that is as diverse as this then i think you have to be more accepting of others and quiet about your own opinions.. or else you will cause offence..

i feel that in my world, you respect others and your elders, and thats the way i have been brought up... i personally find it hard when people occupy themselves with topics that should never involve them. other peoples lives as one.. yes we all have opinions on things.. and if these things effect us then fair enough (E.G youths drinking on the corner of your street, robberys, etc)

i find it hard when people judge others on what they do.. E.G what you have done saying im a hypocrite for getting married in a church etc...when it doesnt really matter to the world if i did or not.. i find it hard to believe that you occupy your time thinking about it..

personally.. i worry more about pollution and the world i live in as a whole.. not what other people choose to do, especially if their choice isnt toxic to my world then why should it effect me?

perhaps i would appreciate what you said lou if you were more considerate, to other people.. and if we actually talked about the reasons the uk is going down hill.. and not the gripes in life that effect us?

 

[Lou]

lou..

on this forum are people from different backgrounds, cultures, races, lifestyles, etc etc etc.. i feel that by making remarks such as many you have are rude, and thats just my opinion.. when you are part of a group that is as diverse as this then i think you have to be more accepting of others and quiet about your own opinions.. or else you will cause offence..

i feel that in my world, you respect others and your elders, and thats the way i have been brought up... i personally find it hard when people occupy themselves with topics that should never involve them. other peoples lives as one.. yes we all have opinions on things.. and if these things effect us then fair enough (E.G youths drinking on the corner of your street, robberys, etc)

i find it hard when people judge others on what they do.. E.G what you have done saying im a hypocrite for getting married in a church etc...when it doesnt really matter to the world if i did or not.. i find it hard to believe that you occupy your time thinking about it..

personally.. i worry more about pollution and the world i live in as a whole.. not what other people choose to do, especially if their choice isnt toxic to my world then why should it effect me?

perhaps i would appreciate what you said lou if you were more considerate, to other people.. and if we actually talked about the reasons the uk is going down hill.. and not the gripes in life that effect us?

The reason I take time thinking about what other people do is because we all have to live in this world together and our children have to mix together and I find it frustrating that people have their kids christened for good schools when there are people like me who are true to themselves and are not willing to pretend to be part of a religion and my child may have to go to a school which isn't as good. Not saying thats what you are doing but no doubt I assume you will send your christened kids to a Christian school? As for the marriage thing it simply baffles me that people don't question why they are making vows to a make believe god? But like you say, thats your business, I'm just voicing my view of it.

I've been myself the whole time I've been on this forum. Sometimes I am rude, sometimes I am sad, sometimes I am happy, sometimes I am opinionated and good for you for having a go back at me, you go for it but do you know what today I really can't be arsed trying to kiss your arse and say sorry and I really can't be arsed explaining myself.

Sorry thats how I feel.

Lou

 

[lisa&alex]

Not saying thats what you are doing but no doubt I assume you will send your christened kids to a Christian school?

assumtion is a terrible tool to use in life.. i havent told you.. im sending my children to a catholic school so why would you assume that i was?

[As for the marriage thing it simply baffles me that people don't question why they are making vows to a make believe god?

i didnt say i dont believe in god.. im just not religious.. does that mean i dont take bits of all different beliefs and use them as mine? when i made my vows.. i made them to my husband.. and in my view as long as i keep them to him thats all that matters really. if i had made them in a civil ceremony then god would have been watching me anyway. if my husband and i choose to get married in a church because we respect our parents and grandparents belifes then i feel proud to have done so.

But like you say, thats your business,

and none of yours.

 

[Lou]

Not saying thats what you are doing but no doubt I assume you will send your christened kids to a Christian school?

assumtion is a terrible tool to use in life.. i havent told you.. im sending my children to a catholic school so why would you assume that i was?

[As for the marriage thing it simply baffles me that people don't question why they are making vows to a make believe god?

i didnt say i dont believe in god.. im just not religious.. does that mean i dont take bits of all different beliefs and use them as mine? when i made my vows.. i made them to my husband.. and in my view as long as i keep them to him thats all that matters really. if i had made them in a civil ceremony then god would have been watching me anyway. if my husband and i choose to get married in a church because we respect our parents and grandparents belifes then i feel proud to have done so.

But like you say, thats your business,

and none of yours.

If you want an argument you've picked the wrong person. I'm not gonna bite. Do you you want, say bollocks to your husband in a church, send your kids to a catholic school whoo hoo. I couldn't be less interested.

 

[Lou]

Only Joking ...oMG runs and hides hahah

You know them days when someone's just trying to get a reaction and you can't be bothered....try and find a pic of a cat scrapping with itself