Male factor secondary infertility

[Wilson14]

I just want to scream the place down and ball my eyes out but I'm at work so I can't. Found out today that me and my husband have 0 chance of conceiving ever due to male factor infertility. He has two children so we are not eligible for any help from the NHS.

My life is just a disaster and don't know if I'll ever be able to deal with this. I'm angry upset and disappointed that my life will never be what I expected.

 

[kj1]

Really sorry Wilson sending lots of hugs xxxxx

 

[tinselcat]

Hi Wilson

That sounds awful. If he has 2 children already then he must have been able to conceive in the past... can I ask where the 0 is coming from?

My ex at one point measured having 0 normal forms for sperm morphology, but after 2 years of good diet, exercise & multi-vitamins, he actually got it up to 8% (the acceptable number is 3%). Not that I'm saying this is applicable in your situation, but for some things there is the possibility of change.

Hope this is not an unwelcome thought, I empathise with how terrible you must be feeling right now. xx

 

[Wilson14]

Hi Wilson

That sounds awful. If he has 2 children already then he must have been able to conceive in the past... can I ask where the 0 is coming from?

My ex at one point measured having 0 normal forms for sperm morphology, but after 2 years of good diet, exercise & multi-vitamins, he actually got it up to 8% (the acceptable number is 3%). Not that I'm saying this is applicable in your situation, but for some things there is the possibility of change.

Hope this is not an unwelcome thought, I empathise with how terrible you must be feeling right now. xx

Yes but that was 21 and 23 years ago, since then he has smoked, drank and also had a hydrocele. Low count, low motility and high number of abnormal forms. Doc said we had 0 chance of conceiving naturally.

We had a huge argument last night and I think that's it for us.xx

 

[WinterWolf]

Hi Wilson. I replied to your comment on another thread. But have you considered donor sperm? I mean obviously that's not for everyone... could be an idea though if you really want a baby and you're physically fit.

 

[Wilson14]

Hi Wilson. I replied to your comment on another thread. But have you considered donor sperm? I mean obviously that's not for everyone... could be an idea though if you really want a baby and you're physically fit.

No not something I'd do and cannot afford it anyway, but thanks for the advice xx

 

[Rach beattie]

I'm so sorry Wilson life is so unfair. I hope one day u get the family u want one way or another x

 

[WinterWolf]

Hi Wilson. I replied to your comment on another thread. But have you considered donor sperm? I mean obviously that's not for everyone... could be an idea though if you really want a baby and you're physically fit.

No not something I'd do and cannot afford it anyway, but thanks for the advice xx

Yep it's definitely not for everyone! I hope you can find a solution where you can be happy xxx

 

[miamia]

I am sorry. However I suggest staying positive and do own research on IVF clinics, particularly in Poland and Czech rep, as they are much, much cheaper. In case of male factor you will probably be advised to undergo IVF PGS NGS, that costs about EUR 5,000 at a top clinic in Gdansk, Poland. Remain positive and never give up xx

 

[1sttimer]

Hi Wilson, I just wanted to draw your attention to something I just read - I don't want to give you any false hope of course but I also find it soooooo irritating that doctors just write off peoples fertility when many of the issues men and women have are reversible...here is an extract from a study I've seen:

Male factor infertility and subfertility are clinical concepts that do not necessarily reflect an unchangeable situation. A considerable, growing body of evidence indicates that male fertility is co-determined by lifestyle, environmental and psychological factors whose negative influences, to a considerable extent, can be reversed or halted. Thus, early systemized efforts to detect and treat any negative influences on male fertility from lifestyle, the environment and psychological conditions could provide better chances for natural conception and enhanced success rates for ART.

My husband had 1% morphology results, lost weight, joined the gym and started taking some really good (expensive but good) supplements, and since than has no issues. I know your man has several factors but could it be worth looking at lifestyle factors to see if you can make a change yourselves?

If you are interested, here is some free advice:

Look at getting him an antioxidant supplement (that is good for the drinking and smoking effects) a male pre-conception (look at wild nutrition supplements, they have a higher absorption rate than basic off the shelf types so although more money - do more but obviously the wellman one if not). Also get him an Omega 3 supplement, essential fats are also really important. Lastly get him on a high protein / low sugar and bad fats diet. So lots of chicken salads lol!! Obviously he would have to knock the drinking and smoking on the head too. I know this sounds like such a lot and many blokes wont do all that, I don't know how amenable yours is so like I say it's just for info really - but I wanted to mention it because GPs are so quick to tell you to go for expensive treatment when there are potentially other alternatives that cost less money - but do require a LOT of will power. They say anything you do now you will start to see the results of in 3 months, would it be worth a shot and then getting another sample done for him to see if there is any improvements? It's a lot to do but wouldn't it be amazing to stick 2 fingers up to the docs!! x I hope I haven't spoken out of turn but wanted to just put it out there in case this is something you didn't know.

 

[Wilson14]

Hi Wilson, I just wanted to draw your attention to something I just read - I don't want to give you any false hope of course but I also find it soooooo irritating that doctors just write off peoples fertility when many of the issues men and women have are reversible...here is an extract from a study I've seen:

Male factor infertility and subfertility are clinical concepts that do not necessarily reflect an unchangeable situation. A considerable, growing body of evidence indicates that male fertility is co-determined by lifestyle, environmental and psychological factors whose negative influences, to a considerable extent, can be reversed or halted. Thus, early systemized efforts to detect and treat any negative influences on male fertility from lifestyle, the environment and psychological conditions could provide better chances for natural conception and enhanced success rates for ART.

My husband had 1% morphology results, lost weight, joined the gym and started taking some really good (expensive but good) supplements, and since than has no issues. I know your man has several factors but could it be worth looking at lifestyle factors to see if you can make a change yourselves?

If you are interested, here is some free advice:

Look at getting him an antioxidant supplement (that is good for the drinking and smoking effects) a male pre-conception (look at wild nutrition supplements, they have a higher absorption rate than basic off the shelf types so although more money - do more but obviously the wellman one if not). Also get him an Omega 3 supplement, essential fats are also really important. Lastly get him on a high protein / low sugar and bad fats diet. So lots of chicken salads lol!! Obviously he would have to knock the drinking and smoking on the head too. I know this sounds like such a lot and many blokes wont do all that, I don't know how amenable yours is so like I say it's just for info really - but I wanted to mention it because GPs are so quick to tell you to go for expensive treatment when there are potentially other alternatives that cost less money - but do require a LOT of will power. They say anything you do now you will start to see the results of in 3 months, would it be worth a shot and then getting another sample done for him to see if there is any improvements? It's a lot to do but wouldn't it be amazing to stick 2 fingers up to the docs!! x I hope I haven't spoken out of turn but wanted to just put it out there in case this is something you didn't know.

Hi 1sttimer,

Thanks for your message, my hubby unfortunately is not very willing to try hard he forgets to even take his Wellman so getting him to take anything else would probably not work, or he'd forget. He has switched from smoking 20 per day to vaping, which I'm not sure is a great deal better but he's definitely smoking much less. Drinking is his biggest problem and I don't think I'm going to change that unfortunately. He has also put on some weight which is bothering him so might be a chance for me to try to improve his diet, lots of leafy greens and proteins I've been trying to push into his diet, aswell as making him lunches rather than buying them. I'm not helping him much though as I keep forgetting to tell him to take his Wellman! He says he'll take them if I leave them out for him. We've had a very stressful last 12 months which hasn't helped at all I don't think but we are just going to keep casually trying now and see what happens in the next 12 months, if not I just have to face my destiny.xx

 

[1sttimer]

Hi Wilson, it sounds to me like you are really helping and already doing lots of things that might help. Rome wasn't built in a day, it has to be done gradually or you just get overwhelmed and totally give up. You never know, even just making those diet changes and him not smoking so much might just show a lift in his sample numbers enough if he was retested to make him think about whether he can do any more. These men...they've got no idea have they! I always used to have to remind mine to take his too - now they are on his bedside table so he just does it first and last thing. What are they like! Wishing you all the luck in the world. I really hope it works out for you - I just wanted to mention it because doctors are so quick to pass you off for IVF like that's the only alternative and it doesn't always have to be the case xx

 

[Wilson14]

Hi Wilson, it sounds to me like you are really helping and already doing lots of things that might help. Rome wasn't built in a day, it has to be done gradually or you just get overwhelmed and totally give up. You never know, even just making those diet changes and him not smoking so much might just show a lift in his sample numbers enough if he was retested to make him think about whether he can do any more. These men...they've got no idea have they! I always used to have to remind mine to take his too - now they are on his bedside table so he just does it first and last thing. What are they like! Wishing you all the luck in the world. I really hope it works out for you - I just wanted to mention it because doctors are so quick to pass you off for IVF like that's the only alternative and it doesn't always have to be the case xx

Yes thank you, me and my husband had that very conversation last night that the doctor was basically totally unhelpful and just wanted her out of her office!
I'm casually OPK'ing this month and haven't told DH to try not to put him under pressure.
Just got to ride it out. All the best to you too.xx

 

[tinselcat]

Hope things pick up for you, Wilson.

I would echo what 1sttimer says, in that it's something that can change with improved male health and lifestyle and diet. When my ex did that, not only did his morphology stats massively improve, but the quantity and motility numbers, which were fine before, went through the roof.

I hope he's prepared to put in (more than a little) bit of effort in for you. Xx

 

[Wilson14]

Feeling really down today, been trawling the internet for success stories of natural conception with men with oligoasthenoteratozoopsermia but coming up with nil poi! IVF with ICSI is even considered to be a waste of time/money. Ovulation in the next day or so but don't know why we are bothering. Seriously fed up with my life.

 

[1sttimer]

https://www.researchgate.net/public...noteratozoospermia_treatment_with_acupuncture

I beg to differ Wilson! Also... in the book in the link below there is a whole chapter on male factor - I really believe this can be done, or at least it's worth a shot? Having seen a few of your other posts and realizing your situ in a bit more detail, I hope I'm not speaking out of turn, but my worry is that it's not the possibility of the cure that's the issue - it's whether your other half is willing to put the effort in. I know they don't get quite the same desperation that we have always but it has to be a 2 way street. If I was you I'd be tempted to put this information in front of him and tell him he needs to make a decision one way or the other, he either puts his all into it for a short time, or you give up entirely because otherwise you're in real danger of resenting him further down the line. Again...I'm not trying to be horrible or tell you what to do, but if it was me or you were one of my friends, I'd be wanting to shake your man by the shoulders and make him realise how much you want this and that it's not just down to you! Tell him he's at risk of losing you altogether. Everything is temporary - he doesn't have to change his lifestyle forever, but if he gave you 6 months... it could be amazing!

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Infertility-Cure-Ancient-Programme-Pregnant/dp/0316159212

 

[Wilson14]

https://www.researchgate.net/public...noteratozoospermia_treatment_with_acupuncture

I beg to differ Wilson! Also... in the book in the link below there is a whole chapter on male factor - I really believe this can be done, or at least it's worth a shot? Having seen a few of your other posts and realizing your situ in a bit more detail, I hope I'm not speaking out of turn, but my worry is that it's not the possibility of the cure that's the issue - it's whether your other half is willing to put the effort in. I know they don't get quite the same desperation that we have always but it has to be a 2 way street. If I was you I'd be tempted to put this information in front of him and tell him he needs to make a decision one way or the other, he either puts his all into it for a short time, or you give up entirely because otherwise you're in real danger of resenting him further down the line. Again...I'm not trying to be horrible or tell you what to do, but if it was me or you were one of my friends, I'd be wanting to shake your man by the shoulders and make him realise how much you want this and that it's not just down to you! Tell him he's at risk of losing you altogether. Everything is temporary - he doesn't have to change his lifestyle forever, but if he gave you 6 months... it could be amazing!

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Infertility-Cure-Ancient-Programme-Pregnant/dp/0316159212

DH also has a needle phobia so acupuncture is a no-go plus we really don't have money to spend on it. We did have a chat at the weekend and he agreed that he will make a conscious effort, the first time he really saw me cry my eyes out over it might have made him realise.xx

 

[1sttimer]

That's great. I hope I didn't upset you with my post. It was 'supposed' to be reassuring but not sure it came across that way. At least he sees your upset now - sometimes they need banging over the head with it!! Anyway...progress, this is good! Best of luck with it! x