Whats wrong with this country!!

[Dragonfly Fi]

interested in why my post was deleted? x

 

[bix]

I'm astonished at the lack of compassion here. Yes it's true we're going through a recession and a scary time but how many people have died? So far in Pakistan the death toll is up to 1500 and it will undoubtedly rise. If I had lost my home, my livelihood, the prospect of food and my family I would hope that support from other nations would be forthcoming. As for foreigners getting the jobs here, sadly the indigenous race (whatever that might be) don't want the mundane jobs that people from elsewhere will do gladly for the freedom that we offer and should be proud of. I also think many of these people would fight for what this country stands for. In the second world war thousands of 'foreigners' died fighting for us.
There are plenty of things wrong with this country - expenses scandal, bankers greed, people living in poverty when we are still one of the richest nations on earth to name a few but closing our minds off to others tragedy doesn't help. Maybe, just maybe extending this gesture to Pakistan will help unite us and help bring peace for the future. If it bought peace for your children would it be worth it then?

 

[Dragonfly Fi]

not ignoring the fact that Pakistan ONLY exists because of British interference, all the troubles they have, the famine, the war, the suffering ALL exists because of us

and yet people deny them 5 million quid in aid... 5 million is bugger all in the circumstance

i raised exactly the same issue but my post was deleted

I also mentioned the fact that we have imposed military rule in Afganistan against the wishes of the Afgan people and therefore have a duty of care to those we are ruling. To abandon them when we choose would be murderous and completely unrealistic

I must add here also, to those complaining about Prince William having his own living space, i would not want my son, husband or friend living amongst royality in Afganistan, it would put the lives of all the men he lived with in jepordy, there are many who would make it their mission to attack a barack containing our Prince, to keep him seperate is essencial

 

[Toonlass]

I'm astonished at the lack of compassion here. Yes it's true we're going through a recession and a scary time but how many people have died? So far in Pakistan the death toll is up to 1500 and it will undoubtedly rise. If I had lost my home, my livelihood, the prospect of food and my family I would hope that support from other nations would be forthcoming. As for foreigners getting the jobs here, sadly the indigenous race (whatever that might be) don't want the mundane jobs that people from elsewhere will do gladly for the freedom that we offer and should be proud of. I also think many of these people would fight for what this country stands for. In the second world war thousands of 'foreigners' died fighting for us.
There are plenty of things wrong with this country - expenses scandal, bankers greed, people living in poverty when we are still one of the richest nations on earth to name a few but closing our minds off to others tragedy doesn't help. Maybe, just maybe extending this gesture to Pakistan will help unite us and help bring peace for the future. If it bought peace for your children would it be worth it then?

I am not lacking in compassion hun. Like i said in the origional post, i am a very charitable person. I often donate to charities and i organise fund raising events. My point is that i only give to charity when i can afford to. I am not going to sacrifice anything for my family to help out others as charity starts at home, but when i have money spare i gladly give it.

I just cant see what right the government has to give our hard earned cash away to a charity when we simply cant afford it. Yes, put out fund raising buckets, have an event to raise the cash, that way all the money that is given to the unfortunate people is given by choice by people who can afford it. The UK is making cut backs left right and center due to the financial situation it is in. People will loose their jobs and homes, will the government throw money at them to help them out? I doubt it.

I feel so bad for the countries than need aid and like i said funds should be raised but the government should make sure that their own tax payers are looked after first xx

 

[Dragonfly Fi]

because our country Created the strife in their country, we cannot avoid or ignore that - its not about us giving to charity when we cannot afford to, its us recongising the moral responsibility we have to these people and upholding that

Pakistan would not exist if it were not for the British, it would be part of India.

 

[Toonlass]

I cant undersand how our country created a flood in their country. Thats why the UK is sending the money right? Thats the issue i was raising xx

 

[Dragonfly Fi]

because if we hadnt created pakistan, they would be supported by the Indian government, as it is we created Pakistan and thus many problems in that part of the world, so understandably have to sort of 'step in' when they are in trouble and they need support

same reason so many pakistany people now live in England... not that people like to discuss our involvment in their problems when we discuss 'foreigners' stealing our jobs... we basically stole their right to travel freely in their own country and forced them to live in a position of civil unrest

which was particularly harsh.

 

[Dragonfly Fi]

when we went into Afganistan, removed their system of government and impliemented military rule (which is what we have done) we took on the responsibility of that country, it was a stupid thing to do for sure, not only did the Afgans NOT invite us into their country, they also didnt want us in their country

but we are there, we are 'ruling' them (terribly by the sounds of things) and so we have a duty of care to those people who we have decided to 'rule'

We have had to give money to Pakistan because we created Pakistan on some sort of ego-fueled cop out when we left India to be ruled by India, i think in the circumstances, 5 million to Pakistan is an insult, we owe them far, far more than that and we are spending far, far more than that on the Popes upcoming trip to England.

i would much, much rather give money to people who through no fault of their own (and every fault of our governments) are forced to live in inhumane conditions and are actually really suffering right now, rather than pay for the popes visit, or the queen to travel the world, or the olympic stadium.

Seriously, of all the wrongs we do with money in this country, i am amazed people are up in arms about us doing something we are morally obliged to do and is actually something we SHOULD be doing

priorites guys, priorites...

 

[Toonlass]

To be honest i dont know the ins and out, i just know that i work hard and pay my taxes only to see money being sent to other countries when the country i live in and adore is in so much trouble and needs the money itself.

I was always under the impression that pakistan was always there, not created by the uk. It was invaded by many different nations including persia, greece, turkey, afghanistan, mongolia and england. Whilst it was part of the british comonwelth, they fought for their own freedom away from both indea and great britain. Therefore they should sustain themselves. I have no problem with helping a nation in need but to suggest we 'owe them' befounds me due to their self indepandance.

As for the 'foreigners' in the UK, i didn't didn't bring up that issue xx

 

[Dragonfly Fi]

have a brief look at the british rule in India, BBC did a film about some of it called Gandhi, it should help to show why we are morally obliged to help these people...

i assume you are just as offended by the popes visit? the oylmpic stadium build and the price to the tax payer of funding the queens travels? only you havent mentioned those...

do you think that some of that is possibly less important that helping the impoverished?

sorry for blunt post, am one handed and breastfeeding x

 

[titch]

Do you know what wound me up.... the fact that we were bidding to host the football world cup. Surely we cant afford that?! It was always in the news alongside a bulletin about how the government are going to have to make £billions of cuts. but then again, I really dont like football, Im not English and dont want my tax money going on football!!! Mind you, the amount of waste I see everyday working in the NHS...

Im gonna stop now before this turns into a very long thread about how mismanaged our nations budget is!!

 

[Dragonfly Fi]

here is some information about the formation of pakistan

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Partition_of_India

which also paved the way for Israel... can of worms anyone?

 

[Me, My Girls & I]

See the thing about the world cup and the olumpics is the revenue it will bring in in other areas, hotels, restaurants, transport etc! I don't have a clue if it outweighs the cost of building stuff tho!! I live with the side effects of nhs cost cutting every day and I'd far rather see more money poured in there than where it actualy goes! And the donations to other countries, we send god knows how much to Haiti, it was on the news not long back that the people hadn't actually seen a penny of it and they were all still loving in tent cities, so it's all well and good us sending aid, but te powers that be need to make sure it actually gets where it's supposed to e going!!

 

[titch]

The same thing happened with the Tsumani on boxing day years ago. The british public vountarily donated incredible amounts of money and it just seemed to disolve before it actually reached anyone who needed it

The thing with NHS cuts is that actually the money is there, but you just wouldnt beleive the stuff its being spent on. A few years back we were desparately trying to get another assisstant to offer therapy programmes to kids and kept getting funding applications rejected. Then I had an email from some 'staff satisfaction manager' who'd made a poster for a hospitals got talent competition and was trying to get people to put htemselves forward to do acts. I nearly exploded that a) this job even existed and b) this person had time to make up posters. I saw a notice up a few weeks later saying the event had been cancelled due to lack of interest!!

 

[Me, My Girls & I]

Omg that's madness! It makes my blood boil! To think my babies are having to wait months and months for treatment they need and someone's sat in an office being paid to make posters!!

 

[titch]

my blood boils on a regular basis working in places like that. When I have to spend a full morning in a health and safety meeting filling in risk assessments for sitting on childrens chairs and plotting maps of fire exits. so much random paperwork created by someone whose job it is to make this stuff up

 

[mablestarr]

I'm loving reading this thread - its a very controversial topic and think its great how people are actually able to freely post their opinions. (Apart from one post which has one post deleted).

I really don't have much of an opinion on the actual matter - the UK being a civilised country does give aid to countries which have had a natural disaster - take the Tsunami a few years ago and the earthquake in Haiti. Giving aid is one thing the UK and other countries in a similar position can do and and do actually do regardless of being in a recession. Aid is given to countries who really need it , and the UK government can't be picking and choosing who they give aid too (although I'm sure politics do play a part in it).

It is dificult to see how the country can afford to give this money when there are so many cut backs, but its something our country can do and I don't have a problem with.

 

[Dragonfly Fi]

my post wasnt deleted, it was quickly moved and edited due to my more than scathing comments about the Pope which would have offended people who may have been Catholic and read it.

This forum is very open to different opinions and ideas xx

 

[Toonlass]

I also like how we can have a healthy debate without it turning into an argument

the olympics I believe will boost the economy which would be all well and good if they weren't over spending on trying to make the venues state of the art and better than the previous counties venues. It needs to be functional not out of this world iykwim

did the uk fund the pope's visit with tax payees money? Isn't the catholic church supposed to be one of the richest bodies in the world?

I don't suppose any of us could run the country, but I think the government should take into account where the people would like their own taxes to go towards xx

 

[titch]

I bet if they turned to the public for donations they wouldve raised more money to donate. Does anyone remember how much people donated for the boxing day tsunami? I cant remember but i know it was loads.