My child = Jekyll and Hyde???

[Dragonfly Fi]

Jasper John is a boobie fed monster. He had tongue tye for the first few days of life and couldnt feed so we ended up latching him onto a nipple shield rather than a boobie (under the instruction of our lactation consultant who is an angel) We have been getting on really well but he has quite bad wind issues and so have been using Coleif, infacol and now gripe water (which is the best and most natural) to help relieve him

In the evening, Jasper generally freaks out for a few hours (who knows what few hours that will be) he is inconsolable, he screams and makes hungry movements but will not latch on to the boob (shield) and gets himself all worked up and goes beyond red into purple

Last night we had the usual 1.5hr fight to get him feeding, managed to Finally get him onto the breast and slowly managed to get him off to sleep around 10pm. He fights sleep so a combination of continous rocking (for up to an hour) in arms and then a stint in the automatic rocking chair is needed to keep him asleep.

Its like every night we have to do things slightly differently, jump through slightly more hoops in order to get him to drop off.

Anyway, last night, we got him off at 10pm, went to be ourselves a few minutes later (jasper sleeps inbetween us) he woke at 1am for a feed, i fed him for about 40mns, good latch on both sides, comfort deep sucking and the end but EVERY TIME i put him down to sleep he would snuffle, wake up and start bawling (we have never had this before, hes always been really happy to sleep inbetween us and seems to know he wont miss anything because we are asleep too.

Liam took over because i was knackered, he was refusing boobie again and getting all irrate (complete with screamy screams) and Liam took him downstairs and fed him some EBM in a syringe (this worked a treat last night, we got some frozen milk, warmed it and fed him that in a syringe til he calmed down and popped him on the boob - that was at 10am though, there was no repeat of chilledness at 2am )

Liam fed him some milk which he promptly threw up (he didnt NEED more milk, he had fed from two boobies for 40mins! it was like he was demanding milk even though there is NO WAY he was still hungry)

Liam took him for 2 hours and he just refused to sleep at all, at around 3.30am Liam brought him up to me and i shushed him to sleep in my arms for about 30mins until he finally dropped off.

Come 8am this morning, Jasper wakes up, refuses to feed properly (again) and just screams and screams, this is a huge problem now because my boobies are like rockets after all the comfort sucking of the night and full to the brim and leaking everywhere and hes getting breastmilk in his eye and refusing to feed and its all crazy

I ended up pumping from one breast whilst he 'sort of' fed from another, we managed to get most of one boobies milk in him but the other boobie i HAD to expresss from because i could feel it was uncomfortable and lumpy in places and i am not up for mastitus, not on your nelly!

So i pumped 4oz out of my slightly sore boobie, whilst massaging the knot and getting it comfy again, he took probably 3 out of my other boob but continued to scream and cry and faff

in the end i gave him some of the EBM in a bottle Is that terrible of us? Will he ever latch on to boob again?

I am starting to think it would be easier to express all day and just feed him that in a bottle, he was so relaxed afterwards and during, no fighting at all and it was actually an enjoyable experience! Thing is though, constant expressing is no fun whatsoever and a total bore as far as going out and doing stuff goes.

Any advice? i have been trying to get him off the nipple shield with ongoing sucesses, but it seems we have just regressed tonight and i have obviously given in to the evils of the bottle!

Aaaargh!

 

[MrsR]

I have no experience breast feeding yet as I bottle fed DD but have to say if he seems 'happier' on a bottle of expressed milk than the struggle for hours to latch on then go for it x I honestly don't believe bottles and bottle feeding is 'evil' and thinking like that is going to drive you mad with guilt when you're still doing a wonderful job as Jasper is getting the nutrition of breast milk plus a happier bubba and calmer parents as jasper is happy x I hope this makes some sort of sense x big hugs darling x you're doing a wonderful job sweetheart, so many people would have given up completely by now and be feeding their baby with formula! X x

 

[Dragonfly Fi]

thanks helen... sometimes its very hard but he;s quite happily draining my boob now!! little monster!!

 

[flexilexi394]

Lol you poor people he sounds like a bit of a monkey! I think I would just express and bottle feed, at least then he's still getting all the boobie goodness, just a less stressful baby and mum! X

 

[Dragonfly Fi]

i think i will bottle feed him ebm when hes stresssing and stick to boobie when hes not stressing, i just cant be doing with the screamy screamy-ness (though the ladies on the 'natural' forum i go on have told me to lie with him naked for a week and not let anyone else touch him - including his dad because hes 'confused about where milk comes from...)

Think i prefer this way.

 

[MrsR]

Lol x what's he like?! x could you play it by ear? When he's happy to go on boob then let him when he's not happy, getting stressed out etc could you bottle it? I have no idea if that's even possible but if it is maybe that's the way to go? X

 

[MrsR]

Think I posted same time as you x lol x basically same thing! Wow I couldn't cope with not having OH touch Seb for a week and I'm sure ge couldn't either! X

 

[Dragonfly Fi]

I know, it would be terrible for them to not have that bond, Liam is the first person Jasper really got used to as i was so tramatised by the birth for the first few minutes and had lost SO much blood that i was dead shakey and couldnt concentrate on Jasper, so Liam had him skin to skin for the first maybe hour of his life whilst i got stitched and sewn and had my placenta pulled out :S

They have a wonderful bond, and a healthy one i think, Jasper is sleeping now like an angel, its amazing how different my life is when i dont have a screaming child! i think we will muddle through and find our way

and i am NOT going to deal with him alone and naked for a whole week whilst watching him really distressed and unable to feed. its just not the way we roll!

 

[Rosie's Mummy]

..its amazing how different my life is when i dont have a screaming child!

I can agree with you there BB but Im talking two years down the line!

Have you asked your HV about this? Sometimes it can be something really simple and sometimes thay can offer a perfect solution xx

 

[Dragonfly Fi]

HV has been really great, shes understanding about the nipple shield and has given us some tips about slowly getting him used to the boob.

all babies scream though dont they, we just have to deal with it as it come! might call her on Monday though RM, thanks thats a good idea xx

 

[Rosie's Mummy]

How old is he now? Could he be colicky? Not much you can do about colic although I used to put Rosie on the floor on her back and massage her tummy or lay her in my arms 'sleeping tiger' and rock her back and forth x

 

[Dragonfly Fi]

hes very colic-y bless him, we have been giving him gripe water with every feed which does help but not enough to prevent the evening merg

 

[Laura_C]

My midwife always told me that if baby is happy, it means a much more relaxed mummy and tbh I think that is the most important thing. Bottle feeding is certainly not 'evil', if it means baby is content how can that be evil. I was disappointed when I had to stop breast feeding but Grace was just so unhappy and she was also losing weight so the decision was made as far as I was concerned. Do whatever feels right for you and your baby xxx

 

[Dragonfly Fi]

i would prefer to express for six months than to give him formula milk, i would do that if neccessary but it would be such a chore

fortunately he went onto the breast today fine so hopefully that can continue and i can just feed him from the bottle when he is really unhappy and struggling to latch on!

 

[amyjayne77]

It's strange cos Oscar also has his evening strop between about 7 and 9 or 8 and 10, then another at 4am where he wants to feed but fights the boob, like he latches on, gulps down lots of air then gets distressed but still wants more iykwim!!

I've never tried him on EBM but am thinking about it. I'm scared that he will forget how to latch on or something. Am I being stupid?

 

[Dragonfly Fi]

Amy this is exactly the problem we are having, he gets himself SO stressed out he just goes mental and its such a pain for all of us... i am going to bottle feed him tonight if he refuses boob and does the bobbing head/fighting/refusal to latch thing and just express whatever he takes, i have bought some Avent Airflow bottles which apparently replicate boob sucking a bit more which hopefully will help him appreciate that the boob is there...

I didnt find it hard to give him boob at all today though, am well aware that i have just given him his last feed until his usual ranty ranty ness but feeling really positive that i have 40z here to feed him incase he refuses to latch and goes all crazy

you know what, if i have to do that once a day and express what i give him back out again, then i am a happy Fi, I dont want to loose my amounts so i will make sure i express what i give him back out again at the same time, but something has to give - these evening and morning feeds are just killers!

Also have you tried Gripe Water? its really good and you just give them five mils after or during each feed, seems to really help Jasper x

 

[amyjayne77]

I might try feeding him ebm at his ratty bum time so he can't mess the same lol.It seems like he can feed on and off from about 7pm til 10, then he falls asleep in bed with us, still attached. So I'm literally confined to the sofa all night whilst he fusses and tries to feed.

It will be really weird seeing him drink from a bot bot . Might try gripe water. i think it's wind that keeps him awake at night. He constantly grunts and squeeks from 4am onwards. Still, he's only young to be in a proper routine yet!? I think?!

 

[titch]

have you considered refux? sounds like he has some signs of it. they dont actually have to be sick, if it only comes up a little its still painful for them. and its worse when lying flat. Will he sleep better in a semireclined position like in a bouncer? If it is reflux there is medication a doctor can prescribe. Hopefully your healthvisitor could sort this out. Have a look at some of these symptoms and see http://www.babyreflux.co.uk/knowledge/questions/3/What+are+the+symptoms+of+baby+reflux?

If it is reflux its best to get treated asap cos the little ones learn very quickly to associate feeding with the pain and then you really do have a battle on your hands. Also if a simple treatment can make your life easier with the breastfeeding then that would be fab

 

[Dragonfly Fi]

mine grunts and squeaks from around then too! Isnt it annoying!

 

[Dragonfly Fi]

have checked the Reflux thing, i do think wind is his biggest problem, his belly is often very stiff where he is full of gas and hes alot better now we have concentrated on getting his wind up lots during each feed

Also its only certain times in the day, its not every feed or even after every feed, just for an hour or two in the evening

also his weight gain is fabulous, the health visitor has told me hes doing amazingly well considering we have never got him properly latched onto the breast and have always used the shield (mind you some of the stories i have heard about bleeding nipples have made me glad to use the shield! not to mention the problems with teething i have been hearing about!

we are battling through and i think if anything its better that he is on the shield if we are going to do a bit of bottle feeding, simply because they work in a similar way and my boobie (gg) are just too big for him to get his mouth round the nipple (even when its quite erect) without not being able to breathe!