Home schooling

[Alexandra84]

My overwhelming memory of school was being frustrated that many of the pupils in the class would not be interested in learning anything and yet got 90% of the teacher's attention due to their behaviour. These same children would also be very aggressive outside the classroom and I felt that I constantly had to watch my back so as to not become another one of their victims. It's not that school was all bad but I honestly felt huge relief when I started A-levels and all of these people suddenly disappeared.

So I wouldn't discard the option lightly, you don't just make friends at school so your LO would still be able to get social interaction with other kids on the street, neighbours, clubs etc. I'd definitely consider homeschooling our children if I have the opportunity and don't need to return to work (esp. since we're planning two more after this one). Like you, both my husband and I have postgraduate qualifications from excellent universities and I honestly think that between the two of us we'll do a much better job than the average teacher, and I'm sure you'd do a stirling job too .

 

[Squeakz]

i was horrendously bullied in primary school so much so that i developed an eating disorder - to the point i lost 4 over 8 weeks and nowi suffer everday andim on the brink of hittinghorrendous againin terms of my eating habits. saying that i wen tto an amazing secondary school however what happened still afected me...........but i still developed amazing friends, so close that one was my maid of honour at my wedding and one is j's godmother.....the school i went to made me a strong fighter and developed my sense of identitiy in a rounded waysomething my mother never could have done had(in a stubborn way determined way not a violent way) she have home schooled us

If joshua is bullied at school i would send him to another school and another school and acnother. i would want to teach him maths science and english andother basics such as modern lanuguages and tbh phil andi cant propvide that level of education despite the fact phil is atrting a PhD and i have just finished a BA in language and linguistic sccience and his dad is a Doctor of Nuclear physics betweenus we couldnt do it.
Phil has been (from nursery through till uni) to 6 school/higher education places andhe managed to do so for me peronally and for phil ( i promise wilma this is not an attack as i feel it could come across just myopionion) if J is bullied hell go to another school and another school...un til he finds one thatworks........

school has been the greatest part of my entirelife and i would never ever change it despite the horrendous experiencesi had..... x

 

[pinkymum]

Please don't take offence at all but I think home schooling is very strange.

OMG just read Wilma's reply and feel really bad, sounds like you had a good reason to home school K and it wasn't a decision you took lightly. Please don't take offence, I have to say I don't know enough about home schooling and shouldn't have made that judgement

Still, I couldn't do it, I'm not stupid but I wouldn't have the confidence to homeschool, especially when it comes to maths!

I was bullied "fat bible basher" got beaten up a couple of times too, all because I was a "bible basher" problem was no one knew that it was a cult I was in and I was very unhappy, so the bullying didn't help. Things got better and by the time I was in 5th and 6th year (Scottish equivalent to 6th form) I loved school,in fact I hated missing school, it was a safe haven for me as I'd been thrown out at 16 and was living in my own flat. If I hadn't had school who knows what would have happened to me!

x x x x

 

[Squeakz]

Can I just say I apologise if my comment last night seemed rather mean I feel I didn't articulate what I wanted to say properly and hope I didn't offend anyone but my bottle of wine may have affected my thought patterns x

 

[inky]

You didnt sound mean to me!

 

[WILMAFLINSTONE]

Please don't take offence at all but I think home schooling is very strange.

OMG just read Wilma's reply and feel really bad, sounds like you had a good reason to home school K and it wasn't a decision you took lightly. Please don't take offence, I have to say I don't know enough about home schooling and shouldn't have made that judgement

Still, I couldn't do it, I'm not stupid but I wouldn't have the confidence to homeschool, especially when it comes to maths!

I was bullied "fat bible basher" got beaten up a couple of times too, all because I was a "bible basher" problem was no one knew that it was a cult I was in and I was very unhappy, so the bullying didn't help. Things got better and by the time I was in 5th and 6th year (Scottish equivalent to 6th form) I loved school,in fact I hated missing school, it was a safe haven for me as I'd been thrown out at 16 and was living in my own flat. If I hadn't had school who knows what would have happened to me!

NO OFFENCE TAKEN Mrs lol!

I know weve all got our own opinions but yeah it wasnt something I decided on in a split second and I did this as a last resort. K ended up in hospital through the bullying in a pretty serious state so for me there was no other option as the school drastically failed us both!
But havinbg said that I would still consider homeschooling Matilda as its something I feel really strongly about.

I LOVED school myself but then again back in the day things were a lot different then to what they are now....xxx

 

[Dragonfly Fi]

I think the 'social interaction' aspect is a complete red herring

children are just little humans and most humans do not last well in institutions. to expect a child to not be daunted/terrified/pushed into bullying or regressive behaviour by attending a school with up to 1000 kids a day is not taking into account that they are little people...

Of course some of those kids become bullys, bullied or depressed - insitutions are fine for a select few but for most they are horrible, horrible places. Think of the other insititutions in our society, we send our mentally ill and criminals in to them. What place is that for a child?

Most homeschooled kids attend homeschooling clubs, they interact with other children (and adults) of all ages, they go to swimming and music lessons together, they write plays and perform them together they have a much more natural mode of education.

Of course some home schooled children are kept in a box and never allowed out but they are few and far between (and usually caught out by the LEA in this country)

I know many homeschooled kids and they are open-minded, communicative and friendly, they dont feel the need to ONLY communicate with those in their own age group, they are happy to speak to adults and learn from whoever is teaching them.

 

[Alexandra84]

I think the 'social interaction' aspect is a complete red herring

children are just little humans and most humans do not last well in institutions. to expect a child to not be daunted/terrified/pushed into bullying or regressive behaviour by attending a school with up to 1000 kids a day is not taking into account that they are little people...

Of course some of those kids become bullys, bullied or depressed - insitutions are fine for a select few but for most they are horrible, horrible places. Think of the other insititutions in our society, we send our mentally ill and criminals in to them. What place is that for a child?

Most homeschooled kids attend homeschooling clubs, they interact with other children (and adults) of all ages, they go to swimming and music lessons together, they write plays and perform them together they have a much more natural mode of education.

Of course some home schooled children are kept in a box and never allowed out but they are few and far between (and usually caught out by the LEA in this country)

I know many homeschooled kids and they are open-minded, communicative and friendly, they dont feel the need to ONLY communicate with those in their own age group, they are happy to speak to adults and learn from whoever is teaching them.

Hear, hear!

 

[Squeakz]

I'm not sure what definition of institution is.....?

 

[Squeakz]

Btw wilmaflintstone- glad your daughter pulled through!! I'm so sorry she had to suffer, tot he point she did!!!!!!!! X

 

[Dragonfly Fi]

Institution;

a. An established organization or foundation, especially one dedicated to education, public service, or culture.
b. The building or buildings housing such an organization.
c. A place for the care of persons who are destitute, disabled, or mentally ill.

 

[Dragonfly Fi]

With regards to schooling

in an institutional facility (such as a school you would:

be expected to eat lunch at exactly the same time as others
be expected to use the bathrooms and toilet on time and when acceptable
be expected to hone your learning to fit in with those around you, no steaming ahead and no falling behind
be expected to be moderately good at every subject, not too good and not too slack at anything
be expected to wear a uniform which made you match your peers
be expected not to display too much individuality, in learning style or in social interactions
not be negatively or positively disruptive or involved in a class, involvement must be across the board and disruption must be dealt with.
bullying must be tolerated to a certain extent and dealt with severely beyond that, a level on 'get on with it' must be enforced,

In home schooling

you can have SOME say in what you eat and when you eat can be dictated by things such as when you got up or how active your morning has been for example
you can use the loo when you need to, not when you are expected to
you can adjust a childs learning to the child, if they steam ahead in some subjects but suffer a bit in others this can be catered for, the only important thing is making sure sufficient time is given to both
you will not be expected to wear a uniform or to match your peers (which actually shows up many perceived 'imperfections' in a child rather than cloaks them in indifference as some would argue)
you can be individual, creative and balance your time to suit that, if a child is very engaged in an activity, a class can be moved and rejigged so they can keep their creative streak
bullying will be noted quickly as all individuals will be well known to the teachers (often parents or friends parents) so small acts of bullying 'you smell' or whatever will be seen and dealt with sensitively, rather than escalating to the point where a person is hurting or negative communication techniques have fallen into place.


Particularly now with the introduction of the internet, there is a real shift towards home schooling. If you can afford to, and if the schools in your local area are not positive ones then it makes sense.

Of course a good schooling experience can be achieved in both situations but thats a call we make as parents. Its good that we have institutions to educate those who otherwise would not receive an education but they are not the only methods of education and this is becoming more and more clear.



It helps if people can bring it into the adult world, how would you feel about working 9-5 in the above situations? would you enjoy it or would you find it challenging and for what reasons?

Then our job really is to look at our children and decide for them how they will fair and if they will need additional support from you to help them with outside schooling or if you feel they would benefit from homeschooling. Homeschooling does not have to be instead of mainstream schooling, it can and should be alongside it at all times. You can also Flexi school and get 'the best of both worlds' to some extent!

 

[Squeakz]

What nakes an institution bad? Is putting a mentally ill person in a specialist hospital bad? What about other cultural and social institutions - would you turn away from them?

 

[Dragonfly Fi]

i haven't suggested that an institution is bad, simply that it is *probably* not the best place to be educated. Simply because it relies on and expects a level of sameness to those experiencing it.

i have no doubt that an education in an institution is better than no education at all, but we arent discussing that, we are discussing the possibilities of education outside an institutional experience,

hence the work analogue, consider working in an institutional setting, would it be alright for the majority of people or would it be hard?

 

[Laura_C]

I just wanted to add after reading BigBumps post that I'm sure everyones experience of schooling is different but I was never denied use of toileting facilities during my time in school and was able to eat my own home made lunch prepared by my mother each day - ok I eat at a set time each day with all my peers but I'm not really sure how that is a bad thing. Routine is key in this sort of environment which personally think is very good for children.

I have a teaching qualification and i wouldn't be confident in my own ability to home school my children but I feel that children can excel even in this type of environment. Teachers are themselve taught to accommodate as many of the different learning styles as they can during their lesson planning. They SHOULD be accommodating to this. Lessons need to be diverse to take this into account. I certainly was given chance to excel at school, I often completed work set and required something more. More often than not this was provided. I was given the chance to sit higher level exams to push me that little further as I had been observed as capable. Likewise for children who are maybe struggling to keep up , teaching assistants are of incredible value to assist the teacher and provide support. Although, teachers have a class of 30 children they should be tuned into their ability and needs. I understand though not all teachers are this good!

My school days were the best time of my life, I had my ups and downs but I do think it is good to be exposed to this. I feel this type of environment prepares you well for your future working life also. Maybe this is because I haven't personally experienced home schooling but I know my parents would not of been capable and I would not have had the opportunities I did have at school.

My daughter is almost 4 and she ha experienced a 'school' environment for the last year at nursery school and she absolutely loves every minute. She tells me how grown up she feels and is buzzing full of knowledge it makes me extremely proud. I think it is good for her to be away from me for a time to develop more independence. It certainly shows

 

[Dragonfly Fi]

I just wanted to add after reading BigBumps post that I'm sure everyones experience of schooling is different but I was never denied use of toileting facilities during my time in school and was able to eat my own home made lunch prepared by my mother each day - ok I eat at a set time each day with all my peers but I'm not really sure how that is a bad thing. Routine is key in this sort of environment which personally think is very good for children.

I have a teaching qualification and i wouldn't be confident in my own ability to home school my children but I feel that children can excel even in this type of environment. Teachers are themselve taught to accommodate as many of the different learning styles as they can during their lesson planning. They SHOULD be accommodating to this. Lessons need to be diverse to take this into account. I certainly was given chance to excel at school, I often completed work set and required something more. More often than not this was provided. I was given the chance to sit higher level exams to push me that little further as I had been observed as capable. Likewise for children who are maybe struggling to keep up , teaching assistants are of incredible value to assist the teacher and provide support. Although, teachers have a class of 30 children they should be tuned into their ability and needs. I understand though not all teachers are this good!

Do routines not need to adjust according to time of life though? For example a county up north did an experiement where they allowed teenagers studying GSCEs to study between 10 and 4 rather than 9 to 3 and discovered some remarkable results. Teenagers are naturally night owls and need a similar amount of sleep to toddlers, yet they are woken often a mere 5 hours after they have got to sleep and expected to work because 'everybody else is' which has been proven in a number of studies to be detrimental to both their health, well being and their educational potential.
This is a classic example of where a strict routine is not helpful across the board.

My school days were the best time of my life, I had my ups and downs but I do think it is good to be exposed to this. I feel this type of environment prepares you well for your future working life also. Maybe this is because I haven't personally experienced home schooling but I know my parents would not of been capable and I would not have had the opportunities I did have at school.

It sounds like you went to a very good school Unfortunately good schools are few and far between and most homeschooling parents would agree that sending a child to a decent, well-funded school with smaller class sizes would be an excellent education (mind you, that is without researching and looking into the dubious curriculum) BUT if you live in the 90% of the country who are not serviced by decent schools, home schooling is a viable option.

My daughter is almost 4 and she ha experienced a 'school' environment for the last year at nursery school and she absolutely loves every minute. She tells me how grown up she feels and is buzzing full of knowledge it makes me extremely proud. I think it is good for her to be away from me for a time to develop more independence. It certainly shows

4 is a very mouldable age, but we dont all stay 4 We grow and develop at different rates and an environment which by its very nature has little room to grow as it must cater for many rather than a few. There is also a situation where those who are academic can pretty much achieve anything, where as those more creative or focused to hand-eye work will find themselves pushed to the wayside.

I have to also add here that UNICEF recently did a study which suggested that of all the 1st world countries, Britain's children are the most depressed and the most under strain. Their reasoning was because of the pressure and bueorcracy placed upon teachers, the low wages of most teachers, the pressures on parents to BOTH have careers and also the fact that we are the only country in the world to send our children to school at 4... 2 to 3 years younger than any other country in the world.

Of course some children will thrive in a school environment, you could even argue that 'most' do (though i must say, i would argue against that statement rather than in favour of it) but some children will always struggle to fit into that mould and it is those that homeschooling can be a fantastic and viable option for. there is also the option of flexi schooling as mentioned above.

In regards to 'preparing for a work environment' firstly i have no understanding of why 4 year olds need preparing for that environment and i also know of no job which requires you to work under the same pressures that you get at a school. Perhaps the army? Or Police force? But even then you are in a station with perhaps a third of the persons that you would find at school, I think its remarkably unnatural! And little or nothing to do with the world of work If we were asked to work in an office of 30 people, 1 manager in a huge office block with 1000's of people in it, most people would find that very hard.

 

[Laura_C]

I don't disagree with some of the statements you have made BigBump but my post is purely based on personal experience and not research studies or experiments. I do believe that schooling should be more flexible and in certain cases I do think that starting school at the age of 4 is too soon some children are ready for this, others are not.

I do agree that home schooling is a viable option certainly, just offering another view as my personal experiences and that of my family, peers has been far from what you described above so I felt compelled to provide our experience.

Some of your reasoning a find a little contradictory though, you say how 4 year olds are very mouldable and we wont all say 4, well of course thats a given, but later in your post you how you don't see how a 4 year old needs to be prepared for a work environment etc. Of course in my entire post I am not just referring to 4 years olds I'm encompassing education as a whole from 4-16. I was just simply referring to my Childs current experience.

With regards to work environment, in your post it is made to sound quite crude but in the grand scheme of things of course this prepares children for working life. Having to get up and out of the house for 9am etc is all a part of that. I have worked since I left school and yes actually I have experienced the type of work environment you describe. Many many people in this country work in office blocks with hundreds, potentially more other people. No school or company would have 1 manager so to speak of course, teachers are not the only staff to 'manage' children in a school. Teaching assistants, learning support, headteachers all form that structure. That environment is fairly typical and yes people don't always enjoy that, but come on most people hate work! - BUT most people do not have that choice.

I don't really want to go any further with my post, I could go on but fear it could be overkill!! I just wanted to offer another point of view. I don't want to offend anyone, so please don't take offence to anything I have said it is purely my experience.

But I do agree that home schooling is most definitely a viable option for some children. I'm not completely opposed to the idea it's just not for me or my children

 

[Dragonfly Fi]

with regards to a 4 year old, my point was that issues that may be created by taking a child out of the home so young may not be evident until they are older.

I have not taken any offence by what you have said, i hope none has been taken by what i said, its a difference of opinion and that is fine

I am not sure why we feel we need to prepare children as young as 4 for a work environment? Surely developing strong family connections, ability to deal with emotions and also ability to have fun are more important at this age than a strong work ethic?

Office work is something many would find difficult, most people work outside of that environment and find smaller companies, shops or franchaises much easier to thrive and feel comfortable in.

If the reason for sending a 4 year old to school for 5 hours a day is to 'prepare them for work' then i ask why we are so quick and keen to do that? Australia, South African, America, France, Germany, Holland, Norway, Finland etc etc etc do not feel the need to send their children to school so young, preferring to wait for potty training and firm family bonds to be established before children are expected to attend an insitution daily.

All children develop differently and it is a great thing that we have an education system that caters for ALL children, its fantastic, however if you are of moderate intelligence and can take initative you can probably education your child far better yourself, you can also offer them security and love that a teacher cannot offer and that is very, very important

There are two sides to the coin, you will never find a 'right' or a 'wrong' answer, but to write off all homeschooling as 'weird' 'unsociable' or derogatory to a child is as narrow sighted as writing off all schools as no better than prisons, you will find people on both side who will do this.


I am just offering a difference of opinion, you do not have to apologise for yours (i wont be apologising for mine )

 

[Laura_C]

No I certainly don't apologise for my opinions, just want to be clear that I most certainly can see this from both sides. I have never said that home schooling is weird, but I do see the social limitations for some children. Just like our education system not all home schooling environments are productive in terms of social development. Both sides offer pros and cons.

I would love to be able to provide my daughter with an environment like this but I simply know that I could not provide that. I have to work to provide for my family unfortunately, therefore I could not be at home to educate her up until the age of 16 - practically we simply couldn't survive. I would end up relying on private tuition and this sort of negates the whole idea for me.

I wasn't going to say anymore but I just wanted to make clear that I dont think home schooling is in anyway weird - just a different approach. Choosing a childs education is incredibly important, I have been tearing my hair out trying to get my daughter into a school environment I am happy with and luckily it has paid off by I suppose only time will tell how truly happy she will be.

 

[Froslass]

We are very lucky to have fantastic schools in our area. The high school I went to was in the top non denominational schools in Scotland, as was the Primary School.

I think If i thought I could give my child a better education at home, I would certainly do it, but I don't think i could.

Inky I think it's really up to what you feel is best for your child, every child is diffrent. Some will thrive in the structure on a school environment, others may do better within the more relaxed home environment.