Expressing help!

[Miss_impatient]

Sorry, this post starts with a bit of a long story but I'm so upset I'm not exclusively breast feeding I think I just need to get it off my chest, bear with me I do have some Q's at the end!

LO born early hours of Tuesday morning. I stayed in hosp until Wednesday afternoon. While I was there I breastfed but LO was only asking once every four hours and only latching on for 5-20 mins at a time. Easy I thought...

4am Thursday morning, get up for feed and cluster feeding began. I had no idea this is what cluster feeding was like. Four hours sat in one position switching from breast to breast. LO would fall asleep on boob but the second I took it away would start seeking and fussing again. The latch wasn't right so my nipples were killing me. Also, I was struggling with position and have back problems so that started to kick in.

Managed to persevere until midwife came at 3pm and she helped me with the latch. This help but by this point my left nipple was so sore that even the correct latch hurt.

I fed all through the appointment and midwife left. However, it was clear I was on another cluster feed and come 7pm LO still attached. On the phone to breastfeeding help line. All they could say was it was normal and to bear with it. Did suggest skin to skin with dad to give me a little break which we did.

Fed again an hour later after a much needed shower lying on the bed as back really giving out. The feed was horrible and fussy but only lasted and hour thank god.

10pm and started again, this time really struggling to get him to latch on, he was screaming his head off and my back spasms while trying to shift position. I nearly dropped him At this point I screamed 'GET ME FORMULA'. Thank god for 24hr ASDA.

So LO has been formula fed since Thursday night. I had a manual pump so managed to express three ounces yesterday. Have so far expressed five ounces today so little one has had at least one portion of breast milk a day which is something I guess.

Electric breast pump purchased today and so far used it twice. I know that supply is demand led and LO has not been to the boob since Thursday night so I'm guessing my supply is low.

I expressed at 4.30 today and got well over two ounces out - left one leading the way with 1.5 ounces right a little disappointing 0.5.

I've expressed again at 7. Again 1 ounce out of left but dribble from right boob. I'm not getting enough out in one sitting but I'm unsure about sterilisation and mixing the milk I get out.

The pump was sterilised before I started pumping. Has now been in the fridge for an hour and I want to try to express again. Can I just whip it out and get going or really do I need to re-sterilise the pump again. Also, do I need to express into a new pot or is it ok to mix the warm and cold milk?

Also, does anyone have any tips for getting my milk supply up? I've been going until flow slows down and shopping because I don't want to damage my breasts. Should I be cluster feeding on the pump or am I right to take a break - ie express for half an hour rest an hour express half an hour etc?

I will try and get LO on boob tonight as I know this will help but any other advice would be greatly appreciated!

Once again, sorry for the long post and thanks if you got to the end as I know you are all busy with your little bundles of joy!

 

[tinselcat]

Hi hun

My tips for getting milk supply up - try expressing/feeding more overnight
The hospital pumps said: express one side, then the other, then back to the first, then the second again, to maximise milk supply.
Drink a LOT of water, keep drinking! don't underestimate how much you need
Oats are apparently good, so maybe have some porridge?
Eat galactagogues (I think that's how you spell it) e.g. fenugreek and fennel are supposed to help
Get some rest & relaxation. Also skin to skin time.

If it's painful then consider getting nipple shields - they come in different shapes and sizes but they got me through the worst of times (bleeding nipples etc).

I would sterilise the pump each time - have you got a microwave steamer steriliser you could use? That did the job in 10 minutes for me (including time to cool down etc)

If a good news story helps, I was doing mixed formula feeding and breastfeeding for the first 3 & half weeks, but have been exclusively breastfeeding since then.

Also, if you are still finding the latch painful, then you may want to just get the midwife to check if baby is tongue tied, as that can cause all sorts of problems.

Good luck xx

 

[Miss_impatient]

Thanks tinselcat. I haven't expressed or fed overnight at all for the last two nights so am going to try tonight and see if that increases production. Just done it again now and a measly one once!

Thanks for all the tips, there are some things I haven't tried in there.

Another quick q - should I be concerned that one side really doesn't seem to be producing. My right side is really letting me down!

Its good to know getting back to bf is possible, I feel like I'm losing out on quality bubba time.

 

[tinselcat]

Hmm, don't know about the one side although at first mine were a bit uneven in what they were producing - I'd keep trying to express on both sides to stimulate them both.

Also another tip I remembered - offer the nipple to the baby first before giving formula. This helps with milk stimulation and also baby doesn't get used to alternative form of feeding so quickly.

Are you still under midwife care? I was doing finger feeding (rather than from a bottle) to also prevent bottle confusion (as the sucking required for a bottle is a different action from breastfeeding). A midwife may be able to help you with this, providing the equipment and guidance etc. It was a lot of faff but I felt it was worth it.

Also, it may be worth checking out breastfeeding support groups in your area and heading on down to those - a friend also recommended La Leche support groups in addition to the normal/NHS type ones.

 

[becky85]

Hi miss impatient - first of all congrats - glad you didn't have to wait too much longer in the overdue club. Secondly I share your breastfeeding woes - this week, whilst amazing has also probably been one of the worst of my life which sounds terrible but I just can't believe how horrific breastfeeding is. Hannah didn't feed at all on day one which didn't worry me as they don't need much then anyway. Day too managed a bit but could only get her to latch if I lay down and sort of positioned my boob in her direction which was so painful and uncomfortable but didn't know what else to do. By Wednesday on of my nipples had started bleeding which meant every feed involved both me and her in floods of tears, the breastfeeding peer support worker came out and helped with latch which has helped but as you say, boobs are now so sore that it's agony. I'm trying to power through and hope that the nips toughen up very quickly, doesn't help that stitches are still very sore so difficult to get a comfy position. I have not been able to express anything so trying to stick with feeding but in terms of some tips that may help that I've heard....
1) Savoy cabbage leaves in the fridge then in bra as has natural antiseptic
2) apply lansinoh cream after every feed (if still bf)
3) express/feed during the night as hormone levels are highest between 2-4 for milk production - Hannah has been sleeping a lot at night and we actually had to wake her up at 2.30am to force her on to my cracked bleeding boob - that was a low point!

Anyway not sure if any of that helps but just to let you know that you're not alone! Another week or so though and we should have it cracked whichever method you opt for

X

 

[tinselcat]

Ooh I just remembered another technique - massaging your breasts to increase milk production. I vaguely recall it involved very firmly slowly massaging down from the top of the breast up (well, all around) to the areola bit over & over, which is where the milk ducts get stimulated or something.

But I think there may have been a step to do before that - maybe worth googling or asking a midwife? xx

 

[kumber]

Hot flannels on your boobs when expressing will help stimulate yourlet-down reflex. I would avoid anything cold on your boobs at this point as it constricts your milk ducts, making it harder to get the milk out.

Unfortunately nipple pain is a norm with bfing so if you plan to put baby back onto the boob, it's gonna hurt. Lansinoh is your best friend at this point.

Do not get help from a mw, they only have minimal training in bf. Ask to be referred to bfing specialist as they will give you more tailored advice.

Finally, remember that expressing is no true indication of supply. Pumping is less efficient than a baby sucking so you will get less milk out. That doesn't mean you don't have enough milk. Eat loads of oaty stuff and fenugreek will also help.

And congratulations

 

[MrsT2011]

Hi Hun I exclusively expressed for 3 months so I can empathise with what you're going through.
My top tips - express every 2/3 hours for a few days as this is what a newborn would feed so it will help your body understand the frequency to produce milk.

When expressing once your milk has stopped flowing keep going for a few more minutes - it tricks your body into thinking that it needs to produce more milk.

You don't need to sterilise between feeds - breast milk is sterile so just put the pump in the fridge and clean once a day.

Try going on kellysmom website - great info x

 

[TTT]

Well done for getting this far!

It honestly gets so much easier and you will reap the rewards. Now, my lo soon started feeding to sleep at night so no more rocking to music for up to an hour, I do night feeds lying down and we co sleep so I don't even have to move and I fall asleep while he's feeding (we did this at 3 months). And so much easier when you're out and about.

I started expressing when we started weaning as we thought he had a milk allergy so didn't think we could put formula in his porridge. You'll never get out what a baby can. I used to have an oversupply and my baby could drain an engorged boob in ten mins vs about 4 ounces with the electric pump in 20 mins. I have mixed cold and warm milk together but expressed the fresh milk into a separate bottle then poured it in to the first bottle.

The best way to increase your supply is of course to let baby nurse but you can add things to your diet like almond milk and they will help.

Its very tiring but my baby went from nursing for an hour when newborn to ten mins at 3 months ish although he will suckle for comfort. If he falls asleep and I think he's full, I take him off. If he opens his mouth I let him latch back on but if he doesn't I think he's satisfied, but let him suckle as long as you can cope with if you need to increase your supply.

I used to prop myself up on the settee when he was tiny and have him lay on me in the frog position to nurse and it helped my back and helped his wind until he was too big.

I used to combi feed until we thought he had a milk allergy so carry on with that if it helps you! I would just try to stick to giving formula around the same time each day to help with your supply for now.

 

[Miss_impatient]

Thanx for all the advice everyone. There is a lot for me to try out there!

I did latch LO on last night but I fear he is already used to the bottles as its not coming out of my boobs as quick as the bottle he got frustrated really quickly.

I expressed at the 2am feed and only got 2 ounces but went again this afternoon and the way the milk was coming out was totally different. I got 4 ounces out quite quickly so I'm feeling better about it!

Becky- it was nice to go so soon after you, I knew I'd be the last to go but at least it was only a day!

 

[tinselcat]

Sounds like you're doing really well xx

 

[Rose83]

I exclusively expressed for 7 months - long story involving undiagnosed thrush that led to this. But quickly here is my advice:

1) you don't need to sterilise the pump every time just once a day as long as you put it in fridge.
2) you can mix milk, as in put in just pumped stuff with stuff that's been in the fridge few hours
3) a breastfed baby should feed every 2-3 hours so set an alarm and stick the the plan eg, pump at 7am, 10am, 1pm, 4pm, 7pm, 10pm, 1am, 4am. Your milk production is unfortunately highest between 12am and 5am so make sure you get 1 or two sessions in then.
4) if you plan on doing it long term the get a double pump that you can put in a pumping bra so you are relatively hands free. I bought the super expensive medela freestyle pump and it was worth every penny for speed and ease but there are cheaper versions out there.
5) lansinoh on the nipples after every session but also its fine to put a smear on before you start as it provides a bit of lubrication between the nipple and the pump to ease your discomfort and obviously it's safe for a baby to suckle after putting lansinoh on so its fine for the milk to touch it as its pumped.
6) if you have damaged your nipples already go to your GP and ask them to prescribe ActiForm Cool wound dressings. They are like a gel pad that heals the wound and you should ask for the 20 x20cm square ones then you can cut them into four for maximum usage. These are super expensive to prescribe so GP might be reluctant but they really work and you deserve them!
7) use the settings on your pump to encourage let down before you let it go to the higher powers. Pump for as long as you are getting a good flow out. Most people who pumping works for get between 3 and 4 oz out each breast every 3 hours when their milk supply is at its height. But some people never get on with pumping and might only get an oz a time. Also some people find electric pumps don't work on them but hand pumps do. You need to find what works for you.
8) just stick at it, if you are determined enough you can manage it. I honesty hated every moment of pumping, it was uncomfortable, I found the sensation so irritating that sometimes I would cry or want to punch my partner just because he didn't have to do it! But I managed 7 months and only stopped because I got pregnant again and my milk supply totally disappeared.

Don't underestimate how many times you need to pump a day - you just need to treat it as if you are feeding baby from breast and they would do it every 3 hours and maybe spend 40mins to an hour each time. Hopefully with a pump you might be quicker but it's going to feel for a while like you are chained to the thing.

Good luck!!! X

 

[Miss_impatient]

Thanks Rose. Wow, I am in awe of your commitment to expressing! Unfortunately I am now trying to wind myself down. I just found that I was spending more time with the pump than LO and he was getting so upset to the point we couldn't get him to settle. Cue no sleep.

I did all his feeds last night, he fed much better then went down after a little cuddle. I expressed once but while I was doing that OH struggled to settle him. When I came back up I managed to get him back off to sleep. Was the first moment where I felt like a proper mummy.

I feel like a total failure that I'm not breast feeding but bottle feeding is creating a happier baby for us!

 

[kumber]

Don't feel like a failure for not bfing cus you're not. Bfing is really bloody hard and you've already done a bang up job. Your baby is being fed and that's all that matters, and a happy mummy = a happy baby.

 

[Miss_impatient]

Thanx kumber - I know I shouldn't but for some reason it really upsets me. Funny really, if you had asked me before I gave a birth I was always very relaxed about it, I said I'd try but what would be would be - the hormones have really surprised me!

 

[kumber]

It's totally natural to be upset but don't beat yourself up