Does toilet training ever end?!!!

[Rooster30]

My son is 4 and we thought back in September that we were finally done and dusted and that our boy was finally clean and dry - this was a year in the making and a ruddy miracle.... that is until 2 days ago... He has started soiling his pants again and only doing tiny poos in the loo and today just to add to it he's weeing himself too.

Now I'm told it could be just the excitment of the festivities and to just try to be calm but honestly, it is easier said than done. We worked long and hard, going through battle after battle to get him clean and dry, we even had to get the health visitor in to help get him toilet trained, but now he has completely regressed. By late afternoon and the umpteenth pant change and me washing poo off his pants it gets pretty darn hard not to just tell him off. I've discussed it with him only for him to poo himself again half an hour later. I don't know how to handle this.

I just wanted to vent. I'm really so so tired of this.

 

[JD.Deedee]

This is likely to be almost unheard of but try the pelvic fysio and rule out that there's no issues with controlling his bowels and bladder. I've heard of this the first time about a girl in my mummy group she's the older child and she ended up going as she weed so much and despite being toilet trained kept weeing herself and it turned out she had a weak pelvic floor even if that's not the issue it might be nice to rule it out to say the least and as pelvic fysios are quite knowledged on the bottom part bits they might be able to help you onto the right direction. X

 

[Rooster30]

As an update this has not stopped since this original post. Infact it has got worse and worse. He is consistently wetting himself and it just doesn't seem like he cares. I took him to the GP this morning and urine test was all clear. He doesn't even care, he just wets himself and happily plays in his mess. I've tried rewards, bribes, taking things away, giving things, begging, everything and nothing is working. I thought this was over but we are back to square one. I am really really REALLy struggling to handle this.

 

[Tigger87]

Oh god rooster - same boat here with 3yo. He has a minimum of 2 accidents a day recently, despite having been 100% for weeks. He's slowly regressed to this. I have mild success by just doing the basics again - no asking, just taking him to the toilet every few hours. I've been trying to bribe him this week with chocolate if he can go all day no accidents. He's only had 1 treat out of 4 possibilities!! I don't think school are very good at getting him to go, he's only been going a few weeks and he's not quite comfortable with them to ask yet. He also wee's as punishment for being told off so time out just makes me SO mad!!!! I'm sorry I'm no help, just wanted you to know you're not alone! Xx

 

[Rooster30]

I've spent the day telling him to go for a wee very 45 minutes or so. I've already forgotten the days when once upon a time he actually took himself to the loo and kept himself dry all the time. Arghhhhhh

 

[Tigger87]

Mine pissed on the floor tonight. Then, when asked if the puddle was wee, he just smirked and nodded his head. They're just SO enraging. We've actually just bought leather sofas so I don't have to take the covers off every other day to clean them!!! X

 

[Elfs Mummy]

Hugs there's a little boy at dds school and they've had the same issue even at school he was soilin 2/3 times a day. Now innyear one it's happened maybe twice so they do grow out of it just seems to take forever xx

 

[cassi]

Something I do on programs (I'm a behavioural analyst) but you MUST rule out any bladder issues/infections etc is called over correction. He wee's/poo's himself you walk him 10 times from where he wee'd to the toilet.

I.e point to the wee "no" walk him to the toilet "you wee in the toilet" X 10. He should also be expected to clear it up, give him a sponge and get him to scrub where he's wee'd, if he seems to like this and find it fun then don't do it, some children think it's fun to clean (most don't though lol!). It's very boring but very effective if done consistently. You MUST pair this with a HUGE reinforcer every single time he wee's/poo's on the toilet. Put a see through container of his favourite thing be it sweets/ipad/toy in the loo. He gets a sweet/the item for 10 minutes instantly after every successful toilet trip. This must only be used for toilet training and never given at other times or it will lose it's effectiveness.

If the above fails you may have to resort to the above plus schedule training, every 20 minutes sitting for up to 15 on the toilet or until he wee's/poo's, building up to every 25 minutes up to 10 minute sittings so on. I have a lot of experience in this....

Edited to add, ignore any protestations, whinging etc and only use the sentences highlighted above. No other talking about it or it can become reinforcing through attention. PPS: if you want to go to scheduling I'd be happy to email you a data sheet I have for this as it's much easier if you track it and also means it can be consistent.

 

[Kay Kay]

Hi Rooster I don't come on much any more but my 3 and a half year old wets himself several times a day, every day. Not a full blown pee but enough to need his pants changed and sometimes his trousers too. We also thought we'd cracked it last year just when he turned 3, we had a period of maybe 6-8 weeks of him being great with hardly any accidents then he started his free hours at nursery 4 days a week (previously only went 1 day a week) he struggled with the change so regressed and we've never got back to the good times! He never poos himself now thank god he will tell me when he needs one but with pees I'm starting to think he just can't control it. I'm so sick of washing pants and trousers!! Interestingly he is dry through the night and has been since we stopped nappies. So he wakes up dry and usually goes to the toilet first thing but if he doesn't guaranteed he'll have peed himself within an hour. He's very strong willed (!) so you can't physically make him sit on the loo if he doesn't want to. Anyway, like tigger I'm not offering much help just wanted to say you're not alone and I'm sorry you're struggling with this. Would threatening to put him back in pull ups bother him do you think??

 

[cassi]

Hi Rooster I don't come on much any more but my 3 and a half year old wets himself several times a day, every day. Not a full blown pee but enough to need his pants changed and sometimes his trousers too. We also thought we'd cracked it last year just when he turned 3, we had a period of maybe 6-8 weeks of him being great with hardly any accidents then he started his free hours at nursery 4 days a week (previously only went 1 day a week) he struggled with the change so regressed and we've never got back to the good times! He never poos himself now thank god he will tell me when he needs one but with pees I'm starting to think he just can't control it. I'm so sick of washing pants and trousers!! Interestingly he is dry through the night and has been since we stopped nappies. So he wakes up dry and usually goes to the toilet first thing but if he doesn't guaranteed he'll have peed himself within an hour. He's very strong willed (!) so you can't physically make him sit on the loo if he doesn't want to. Anyway, like tigger I'm not offering much help just wanted to say you're not alone and I'm sorry you're struggling with this. Would threatening to put him back in pull ups bother him do you think??

I doubt a threat of pull ups would make any difference. If he's strong willed you need to be more strong willed than him you're in charge! You can give him something to keep him occupied whilst sitting just not the most 'favourite' thing. That's for weeing. I have this procedure to a T with children with autism who can be incredibly strong willed, you have to make the whole situation reinforcing whilst remaining in control. He obviously has that bladder control but going to the toilet is boring when you're doing something much more fun, then it's too late!! He needs to learn that it's not acceptable and if he needs to go it's on the toilet. Good luck!!

 

[Rooster30]

Thanks for the tips. I have contacted my Health Visitor and booked a GP appointment. However, we have had slight improvement thanks to me taking him to the loo every 30 minutes or so (or between activities) and this has lessened the accidents. Since Thursday we've seen very few accidents. I have also bought a bag of chocolate buttons and told him he can have one each time he takes himself to the loo... needless to say I haven't parted way with many. He usually takes himself after a nap and that's it.

Argh, it is such hard work!

 

[Moomin21]

My son is 20 months and is now completely trained for wees apart from he has a pull up for bed as he isn't dry at night yet. He has suddenly started refusing to pop in the toilet so holds in his pop until he gets the pull up on and then goes! It's very frustrating. We have bought him a new Thomas engine and told him he can have it as soon as he pops in the toilet but he still won't? He has no accidents with wees. Any tips? Xxx

 

[Moomin21]

Post above supposed to say POO! My phone changed it to pops!! Xxx

 

[cassi]

does he always poo at a certain time? If so do the sitting technique above but for shorter periods, then 10 mins break and back on. Make sure he really really Really wants the toy you've put aside for it and it isn't something he has otherwise. If he was older I'd recommend a fluid restriction after 5/6pm and losing the pull up. But he genuinely may not have that bladder control. To solve the problem really you need to lose the pull ups. Another way you can do this is by leaving him sans pull up and pick him up and pop him on the loo for his wee in the middle of the night gradually making it later and later until his mind is trained to find it 'odd' to wee himself. Google 'social stories for going for a poo on the toilet' too. He may find it worrying, it may have been painful once when he went on the loo and that could cause an association between pain and
The toilet.