I'm off to hospital! **UPDATE- I'm home again!*

[JJ Mum]

Epidurals really do lower your blood pressure - it's a side effect, I have a spinal one when I have my csections and every time, they have to stop , while I go all dissy, BP drops down and I throw up in a pot, all while lying down

Good luck hun for the birth - you will be just fine X

 

[ickleprawn]

Can I ask what your reasons for not wanting one are? Some of my friends have had one and thought they're brilliant. I don't want one because you're more likely to need forceps or ventouse from what I've read but was planning on just going with the flow as I've not done this before!

 

[inky]

The only reason I don't want one is I want to be able to stay mobile, I can't stand the thought of being confined to the bed...

 

[ickleprawn]

Hmmm know what you mean! I don't like the idea of not being able to feel how much to push and having to rely on the midwife. I've also been told that because I have SPD I have to measure how much I can open my legs so that they don't do me any more damage if I have an epidural - sounds bloody awful!

 

[titch]

Epidural blocks carry some risks to the mother, fetus and newborn. Undesired effects tend to be greater with larger doses of medication, a longer interval during which the medication is in effect and immaturity or distress in the fetus.
Undesired effects on the mother:
Inadequate pain relief (up to 10%)4

• Rise of the mother's oral and vaginal temperature 5, beginning within one hour after administration of the epidural, which may lead to treatment of the mother and baby for non-existent infection. This effect may be dose-related. This recent finding from England is being investigated in the United States.6
• Drop in the mother's blood pressure treated with position changes, oxygen and possible vasopressors (less likely if a bolus of IV fluids is given before the epidural).
• Short or long-term postpartum backache from bruising caused by the injection or from ligament strain caused by prolonged time spent in a damaging position or inappropriate movement (for example, extreme passive flexion of the mother's trunk, hips and knees during the second stage, or sudden vigorous movements of the mother) while her muscles are relaxed and her back is numb (up to 19%). Long-term backache is almost twice as likely to occur with an epidural than without.7
• Possible unintentional spinal block and resulting spinal headache requiring days of bed rest and a blood patch.
• Shivering may be reduced with lower doses, by warming of the anesthetic before administration, or by adding narcotics to the anesthetic.8
• Mild to severe itching of the skin (with narcotics)
• Retention of urine, requiring a bladder catheter1
• Mother feels detached from the process and becomes an observer; others may reduce emotional support. The nurse can no longer assess labor progress by observing the mother and must rely more on the monitor and vaginal exams.9
• Problems caused by human error or maternal structural anomaly, such as inability to place catheter properly; inadvertent injection of anesthetic into a blood vessel; or too much anesthesia, affecting respiration and swallowing (rates vary with skill of the practitioner and anatomy of the mother).
• Rare complications, such as residual numbness or weakness from needle injury to nerves (almost 1 in 10,000)10, delayed respiratory depression with epidural narcotics (up to 12 hours later)8, and brain damage and death (extremely rare)11.

Undesired effects on the labor:

• May slow labor, requiring Pitocin; and has been found to increase the chances of a cesarean delivery in primigravidas by two or three times.12
• Often slows second stage by reducing or eliminating the normal surge of oxytocin; and by reducing pelvic floor muscle tone, which may lead to more deep transverse arrests or persistent occiput posteriors. In addition, forceps or vacuum extractor are required more often (20-75%). Delaying pushing until the fetal head is on the perineum reduces the need for forceps. Even though this approach lengthens the second stage, it does not increase the incidence of fetal distress.13

Undesired effects on the fetus:

• Abnormal heart rate patterns, requiring oxygen to the mother, position changes and possible cesarean delivery.
• Increased likelihood of newborn septic workup, IV antibiotics and isolation in the nursery if the mother develops an "epidural fever" that causes fetal tachycardia or newborn fever.
• If the fetus is already stressed greater amounts of the medication are "trapped" in the fetal circulation, leading to more pronounced newborn effects (see below).

Undesired effects on the newborn:

• Short-term (six weeks or less) subtle neurobehavioral effects, such as irritability and inconsolability and decreased ability to track an object visually or to shut out noise, bright light.4 There are no data on potential long-term effects.
• Possible less efficient or less organized initial rooting and suckling behavior. Nurses have reported more difficulties in feeding babies whose mothers had an epidural when compared to unmedicated babies.6
• Decreased infant responsiveness may lead to long-term consequences for the parent-infant relationship.14 Parents should be counseled to give their babies time to recover from the birth and medication and should avoid a label of "difficult child" or "incompetent mother."

http://www.childbirthsolutions.com/articles/birth/epidural/index.php

lots of the effects on fetus and newborn were news to me! Its got benefits of epidural on the website too, Im not trying to misquote, just that this explains better why some people dont want the epidural. Personally I think that episiotomy is just mutilation and scares the **** out of me that someone would try and do it to me, so Im not doing anything that might make them do that!

 

[ERIN84]

Thanks for the info guys. I'm totally anti-epidural for a few reasons really. The above risk factors obviously and just hearing real expereinces of them.

My business partner had one and has told me how hers went and I just hate the sound of it. She didnt feel the urge to push, she didnt feel her baby come out, she had to have forceps and then when she had callum, she said she was back on the ward and crying and she couldnt even get up to pick him up as there was a complication and she didnt get the feeling in her legs back for a while. not able to go and have a shower etc - I'M NOT HAVING ONE!

Obviously I know its going to be VERY painfull but im determined to get through it with gas and air and possibly pethadine or diamorphine if I'm really struggling. Fingers crossed!

 

[titch]

^^ its not VERY painful for everyone. think it varies from person to person and position of the baby. Aparently less painful the more relaxed you are too.

 

[inky]

God they just sound awful don't they?! Tiny is right about being relaxed, you will breathe better if you're in a more relaxed state - mw who did my antenatal class yesterday said the key is to keep your shoulders down!

 

[ERIN84]

Exactly, the way you feel in your mind makes a big difference. The more tense I get, the worse it will be!

My mw asked me the other day if I had been thinking about pain relief and I said not really, as I dont want my birth expereince to be based on "pain" and she said how refreshing it was to hear! I guess I'm gonna take it as it comes....

 

[titch]

I suppose they have to offer. Bet if they didnt offer an epidural to a woman during her labour, she might kick up a stink about it afterwards and make a complaint about being forced to 'suffer' etc..

I do feel sorry for midwifes, I think they have to follow so many policies and procedure, they dont actually get to help women in the way they would really want to.

 

[inky]

My midwife said they are so restricted she couldn't even suggest that I breast feed! She was so relieved when I offered my wish to bf and she said while she would sing it's praises from the rooftops if she could, she has to be careful to be sure she isn't seen to be influencing the mum - crazy when my mw clearly knows best out of the two of us! Guess it's the same where pain relief is concerned!

 

[titch]

thats terrible!!!! I would see it as their job to give me recommendations of what they believe is best for me. I know that they dont know me, but they know birthing a lot better than I do, so if we worked together honestly, we'd surely come up with a decent plan. Bloomin policies and procedure!!!

 

[amyjayne77]

In my early labour i was really focussed on relaxing and visualising my baby boy through each contraction and remember the mw's saying"oh you're coping so well you'll be fine etc". I said to them, "i'll warn you now, ll be screaming for an epidural soon" and they kept saying"oh you'll be fine!". Pma really took the pain away.

10 minutes later I was demanding every pain relief going and pushing without realising and being told the baby was coming out. I remember him flying out and saying "i guess it's too late for that epidural!"

Yes I felt everything, like the head turning on the way out (he was back to back) and it sounds weird I remember telling them I could feel the shapes of his face travelling down my twinkle (urgh i know) but I don't know if I'd have felt the urge to push or if my body would have taken over like it did if i'd had the epi.

I had the epi with my 1st had didn't have a clue what to do and when. But it didn't hurt as much lol x

 

[Lander]

I do feel sorry for midwifes, I think they have to follow so many policies and procedure, they dont actually get to help women in the way they would really want to.

This is one reason why I stopped my training after six months, there were other reasons too but the final delivery I witnessed kinda did it for me.

It was a difficult delivery and had come close to going badly so all the MWs were called in for a de-brief afterwards.

So I (1st yr student, 6th week on Labour Ward) was they only person there for this first time Mum, 20 years old, whose family had also all gone out off the ward to call other family etc about the birth.

I just felt glad I could help her change clothes, get her some tea and toast and then actually give her baby to hold. The MW had just left her in the cot and Mum couldn't even see her from the bed

I would like to train as a Doula in the future, I am a bit pregnancy obsessed...

 

[titch]

shocking! Bet youre glad you got out when you did!! I think a job as a doula would be much more rewarding too. I cant find any near me, Im very tempted, cos Im starting to lose confidence in my OHs understanding of whats gonna happen, even though he really does want to help.

 

[Rosie's Mummy]

Phew Erin Im so glad you are ok, I have been wondering about you all week! I have my connection back now so I can keep track of everyone now xx

 

[ERIN84]

Thanks! Nice to have you back, we have missed you around here! xxx

 

[Rosie's Mummy]

Aww thats so sweet!