Good books about psychological aspect of bringing up children?

[i.love]

I've read a few books about how to care for your child's health - how to feed, bath, put them to sleep, etc. Now I'm after some advice on the psychological aspect of raising a child. I am looking or a book that would address questions like:

- to punish or not to punish a child? If yes, from what age and how? Is bribing them with sweets a good idea? What about the naughty step and reward charts, or whatever they are called?

- how to teach a child to be tidy and to do work around the house?

- is it ok to make a child do things by scaring them? Like: "if you don't brush your teeth, they will all fall out" lol. Or "if you don't stop crying, I will call a witch/gremlin/policeman and they will take you away". I don't think it's acceptable, but some people do this, unfortunately, including my dad. Would be good to be able to show him a book that says not to do this!!

You get the idea. Any recommendations? And what do you think about the above?

 

[greekgirl84]

As a teacher I bought a book about toddler training . Really good with high recommendations . It's at my mums so I'll update later with the name x

 

[BevG]

i would punish them, naughty step etc at about 2 or so, bribery isnt so bad once they are old enough but as a little child i think it sends a bad message but teenagers respond well to it lol. for really bad behaviour i dont think there is anything wrong with the odd smack but its more the threat of punishment and them knowing you will carry it out than what the actual punishment is. as for threatening them with things its a bad idea because those things will never happen and once they figure it out then you will have no authority and no control because you lied. its bad idea to lie that way as they learn that your just saying it and nothing will happen so its like they dont have to listen to you.

 

[willowwisp]

You want books on positive parenting and positive reinforcement. Threatening or using routine punishment as methods of controlling behaviour are not what is going to be happening in our household either.

The science behind positive reinforcement (and it's effectiveness over negative reinforcement and punishment based methods) is very solid and well documented, you shouldn't have any trouble in shoving a whole shelf of books at your father on the subject.

It's also worth noting that positive reinforcement is NOT about bribery. Bribery is 'if you sit quietly for 5 minutes we can get sweets on the way home' and if they fail the punishment is no sweets. Where as with positive reinforcement you would have the sweets already and for every minute they sat quietly (such as dentist, doctors or where ever you are) you would say well done you and let them choose a sweet. If they start making a fuss you just ignore it and then you wait to get that one minute of quiet and reward it with a sweet. It doesn't take long for them to realise that making a fuss gets no attention at all and being good gets them all the right things. It's about setting then up to succeed and rewarding success. Makes life a much more positive experience for everyone.

 

[Maria1977]

i would punish them, naughty step etc at about 2 or so, bribery isnt so bad once they are old enough but as a little child i think it sends a bad message but teenagers respond well to it lol. for really bad behaviour i dont think there is anything wrong with the odd smack but its more the threat of punishment and them knowing you will carry it out than what the actual punishment is. as for threatening them with things its a bad idea because those things will never happen and once they figure it out then you will have no authority and no control because you lied. its bad idea to lie that way as they learn that your just saying it and nothing will happen so its like they dont have to listen to you.

I totally agree with all of this. We have had to start disciplining Oz, he is really testing atm and pushing the boundaries and positive reinforcement does nothing, knowing his boundaries and that there are limits is working, although it is not something that happens over night, you get sick of yourself saying NO lol But it's a battle of wills and he needs to know where the line lies.

My MIL was a TA and all they did was positive reinforcement, and rewarding bad behaviour It doesn't work imo (and at that school, it has a bad rep for little *******s) and there is now a generation of little sh*ts out there who think it's ok to break the rules and do what they want as there is no proper comeback. Sorry just my opinion though!!

I don't see anything wrong with bribery, not at Oz's age as he is too young to understand, but a bit older with the teeth cleaning example, I'm fine with that lol

 

[i.love]

i would punish them, naughty step etc at about 2 or so, bribery isnt so bad once they are old enough but as a little child i think it sends a bad message but teenagers respond well to it lol. for really bad behaviour i dont think there is anything wrong with the odd smack but its more the threat of punishment and them knowing you will carry it out than what the actual punishment is. as for threatening them with things its a bad idea because those things will never happen and once they figure it out then you will have no authority and no control because you lied. its bad idea to lie that way as they learn that your just saying it and nothing will happen so its like they dont have to listen to you.

I like your reasoning about the threatening! Makes lots of sense x

 

[i.love]

You want books on positive parenting and positive reinforcement. Threatening or using routine punishment as methods of controlling behaviour are not what is going to be happening in our household either.

The science behind positive reinforcement (and it's effectiveness over negative reinforcement and punishment based methods) is very solid and well documented, you shouldn't have any trouble in shoving a whole shelf of books at your father on the subject.

It's also worth noting that positive reinforcement is NOT about bribery. Bribery is 'if you sit quietly for 5 minutes we can get sweets on the way home' and if they fail the punishment is no sweets. Where as with positive reinforcement you would have the sweets already and for every minute they sat quietly (such as dentist, doctors or where ever you are) you would say well done you and let them choose a sweet. If they start making a fuss you just ignore it and then you wait to get that one minute of quiet and reward it with a sweet. It doesn't take long for them to realise that making a fuss gets no attention at all and being good gets them all the right things. It's about setting then up to succeed and rewarding success. Makes life a much more positive experience for everyone.

Positive reinforcement is what we used on our puppy lol - completely the same thing! I must say she is not the best behaved dog now though maybe we weren't persistent enough!

 

[littlemiss83]

Whichever book you get, it kinda depends on what approach you want to take if that makes sense. Your seldom going to get a book that fully explains the different ways of bringing up children, for example if you wanted to make an imformed choice on discipling, no one is going to tell you what way is best, you have to read up on not-disciplining and disciplining, if that makes sense, if you just read books on the benefits of not using the naughty step for talking sake, you are never gonna hear about the downside. Duno if that makes sense, but thats worth considering b4 buying a book. Your always gona hear good things & bad things about each parenting method.

I think discipline works, but it has to be done strictly, ie...not giving up one day just for a bit of peace. In adult life if we do things that are wrong, there is consequences, discipline is teaching our LO's that, no one denies that they need to be tought, its just that there is so many different ways of doing it. As I said, its about finding one thats right for you.

As an automatic thing, I treated my LO & disciplined her the way I was by my parents & grand-parents. Its worked well as she never ever pushes her luck, she is well behaved but has to be prompted sometimes which is fine. She's very rarely punished - our punishment only goes as far as....you'll go to bed early, which isn't too bad coz she's 7. When she was younger, it was simple, she did something wrong & she didn't get a treat (wether it was a play in the park or a bit of chocolate) she soon realised that those treats are rewards for being well behaved - hense the reason she behaved.

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[i.love]

Whichever book you get, it kinda depends on what approach you want to take if that makes sense. Your seldom going to get a book that fully explains the different ways of bringing up children, for example if you wanted to make an imformed choice on discipling, no one is going to tell you what way is best, you have to read up on not-disciplining and disciplining, if that makes sense, if you just read books on the benefits of not using the naughty step for talking sake, you are never gonna hear about the downside. Duno if that makes sense, but thats worth considering b4 buying a book. Your always gona hear good things & bad things about each parenting method.

I think discipline works, but it has to be done strictly, ie...not giving up one day just for a bit of peace. In adult life if we do things that are wrong, there is consequences, discipline is teaching our LO's that, no one denies that they need to be tought, its just that there is so many different ways of doing it. As I said, its about finding one thats right for you.

As an automatic thing, I treated my LO & disciplined her the way I was by my parents & grand-parents. Its worked well as she never ever pushes her luck, she is well behaved but has to be prompted sometimes which is fine. She's very rarely punished - our punishment only goes as far as....you'll go to bed early, which isn't too bad coz she's 7. When she was younger, it was simple, she did something wrong & she didn't get a treat (wether it was a play in the park or a bit of chocolate) she soon realised that those treats are rewards for being well behaved - hense the reason she behaved.

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I know what you mean, ideally I was hoping to find a book that might address these issues from different perspectives and compare different methods. I don't know if such books exist though.

I am for discipline, especially as I have a boy and think that they might need discipline more than girls. But I don't know much about how to teach kids. For example, I still don't know how naughty steps and reward charts work exactly I am from a different culture and Russians just don't use such things as far as I know. So I want to research these things - I might find them useful!

I know it's all common sense in most of the cases and depends on the particular child and on particular parents. But it would be nice to read up on different approaches and generally recommended 'techniques', it might help me to sort my own thoughts iykwim.

 

[leannesxb]

I have rewarded Dylan for many many years with nice treats. That is sometimes sweets, comic, etc now it is time out. Tomorrow we are going for breakfast as he has been so helpful. I never threatened him with people eg if you are naughty a policeman will come etc cos I never wanted him to be scared of them as a child. I did however tell him I would tell nanny or grandad (2 of his most favourite people in the world) I still do that now at 14. lol
I used to when he was little make the house work a game we would take all the photos etc off and dust them and we would play shops with 1ps. Little things like that make a difference I found.

 

[BevG]

the naughty step / chair / room etc are just a place you put lo for time out, 1 min for each year of age. they have to stay there for x minutes and then apologise and get / give hugs and cuddles.

the important bits are to give a warning ...if you dont stop doing that or whatever you will go on the naughty step. then if they continue in the behaviour put them on the step, if they leave it then put them back and the time starts over til they sit for the whole x minutes. dont talk to them or give them extra attention until they have served their time and when getting the apology you have to say you were put on the step for'''''' reason, mummy wants you to say sorry. then hugs.

 

[i.love]

I used to when he was little make the house work a game we would take all the photos etc off and dust them and we would play shops with 1ps. Little things like that make a difference I found.

I like that! Hopefully would help them see chores as something that can be actually enjoyable!

 

[i.love]

the naughty step / chair / room etc are just a place you put lo for time out, 1 min for each year of age. they have to stay there for x minutes and then apologise and get / give hugs and cuddles.

the important bits are to give a warning ...if you dont stop doing that or whatever you will go on the naughty step. then if they continue in the behaviour put them on the step, if they leave it then put them back and the time starts over til they sit for the whole x minutes. dont talk to them or give them extra attention until they have served their time and when getting the apology you have to say you were put on the step for'''''' reason, mummy wants you to say sorry. then hugs.

Sounds simple enough, but what if he doesn't want to apologise? Or just apologises to be left alone without meaning it? I thought that 'sorry' is only valuable when they mean it and want to say it themselves, not because they must.

 

[AugustMum]

I use positive reinforcement with my LO and have found it fantastic. Its testing at times and if she's really pushing it i find i have to just step away. If she does something wrong like throw food off the table i ignore it but make a big effort to say what a clever girl she is when eating her food nicely and she very rarely throws food now. I also explain everything. So if she does something.dangerous and i may have to raise my voice I'll always explain why i panicked and why its dangerous.

I've found both these work.brilliantly but that doesn't mean i always do that lol. Sometimes i do have to move her away and not always stick to it. I've heard a way of it being explained as thinking of all behavior as good behavior. So even when they're doing something wrong it's probably because they want to communicate something they can't or they don't know they shouldn't do it and so its not technically bad behavior. Does that make any sense? I rambled a bit there!

 

[i.love]

I use positive reinforcement with my LO and have found it fantastic. Its testing at times and if she's really pushing it i find i have to just step away. If she does something wrong like throw food off the table i ignore it but make a big effort to say what a clever girl she is when eating her food nicely and she very rarely throws food now. I also explain everything. So if she does something.dangerous and i may have to raise my voice I'll always explain why i panicked and why its dangerous.

I've found both these work.brilliantly but that doesn't mean i always do that lol. Sometimes i do have to move her away and not always stick to it. I've heard a way of it being explained as thinking of all behavior as good behavior. So even when they're doing something wrong it's probably because they want to communicate something they can't or they don't know they shouldn't do it and so its not technically bad behavior. Does that make any sense? I rambled a bit there!

So, for example, what would you do if she would start pulling your hair? Or paint on the walls? You can't really just ignore that can you?...

I'm not sure I am patient enough for a full positive reinforcement approach. I def agree with the explaining things approach though. It used to work with me when I was little better than anything else. I hated to be just told no with no reason, but was very responsible and would not do anything naughty if I knew why it was bad.

 

[AugustMum]

She's done both those things! I've taken two approaches and both worked fine. I didn't yell but just moved her and sat her down without talking and then sat with her and explained that it's not very nice to pull hair and it hurts mummy (or who ever else it was). With the drawing on the walls I usually take her away from it and say that we should draw on the paper not the walls and go and get her some paper to draw on. Now with drawing she always comes and asks me to draw and so we get the paper out and she's only pulled my hair once since then and that was because she was climbing on me and not because she thought it was funny, so I just asked her to be careful.

It takes ALOT of patience sometimes and like I say, sometimes I just don't have the patience to keep it up but I will always explain even if Im at the end of my tether lol.

 

[Kbex]

I have got a two and half year old and use a mixture of everything but consistently. Had a bit of a watershed a couple of weeks ago after about hundred returns to the naughty step. Sometimes it's s battle of wills and ultimately she has to know I am the boss. The best thing is to avoid the conflict in the first place by play, patience, time etc. Any physical acts such as hair pulling, pushing etc are straight on the naughty step as she has had it explained to her that's what will happen. I use the concept that she must be kind to people as it feels more positive message for her than lots of no's. I also explain things to her but realised that I did that a bit too much and it was becoming a negotiation when sometimes after I have explained why the next response is simply that I say so. If she is getting carried away or not listening than I check she is listening give her a warning often with a countdown followed by the naughty step. Generally she is very good but all toddlers have their moment especially when there is a younger simbling around