hopefully some useful info to pass along...

soffphie

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hi guys, thought id share some info i just got off my free nurse consultation. it kinda depresses me a bit these fee's but i'll go into that later...

so.. as we have sperm issues with fertility her general take on it was this..
1. stop ashwaganha and black maca as they are a herb and not really proven - she said black maca would need to be taken in 3000mg for example and sometimes when you go excessive your body can just 'pee it all out' basically..
2. she recommended: selenium, zinc, vitamin d, c and folic..
3. selenium dose 100mcg,others she didnt go into..
4. recommended eating eggs for him
5. said wellmans is fine but read what it has in it and dont overdose on other supplements
6. said my amh 21.8pmol/l is good
7. since sperm issues has to ICSI ivf.. i kept trying for it not to be but apparently it has to be..
depressing part...
£1000 drugs
£150ish s/a they would want to do regardless
£200 consultant fee
£6000 1 cycle, £10,300 2 cycles (with 50% refund) and £11,400 cycles (with 50% refund) said ivf seldom works in 1 cycle. sending me a booklet. i genuinely thought we had enough money for ivf, we have 10k now.. turns out perhaps not! so dang depressing. id imagine going for 2 cycles would be best with potentially £2000 drug fees, £150 s/a and £200 consultant charges...? basically looking at needing 15k really.

*EDIT* Crimson Publishers Open Access Publishers was the page she was using.. you can search selenium sperm for example to see what it says etc etc..
 
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Gosh it is expensive isn’t it..

We had a quick look last night on some sites of the clinics around us and it’s scary. We could have enough saved in 5 or 6 months depending on how kind life is to us but it’s no guarantee it would work and after 2 failed nhs cycles is it worth spending so much money.. on. It is depressing!!

I know some people go abroad for ivf as it’s much cheaper. Wouldn’t know where to start looking though!
 
Gosh it is expensive isn’t it..

We had a quick look last night on some sites of the clinics around us and it’s scary. We could have enough saved in 5 or 6 months depending on how kind life is to us but it’s no guarantee it would work and after 2 failed nhs cycles is it worth spending so much money.. on. It is depressing!!

I know some people go abroad for ivf as it’s much cheaper. Wouldn’t know where to start looking though!

im probably seeing too much into it bu why has it got to be ICSI for us? she says its just the way it is when sperm issues but why!? it is really that low of a chance otherwise? and if its low there is it borderline impossible for natural then?? mind blowing :( its so flipping depressing.. UNLESS they do ICSI because ya know.. people have paid and they wanna get as good success rate as pos & more chance that with ICSI? no idea.. :( i know prices above are for 35 and under and tho expensive in my case they seem to include a lot of extras you'd pay for on top normally so.. freezing, transfer etc.
 
It is expensive isn’t it, I hadn’t looked into fees before but always heard it was about £5k so just had that in my head. Do you think you’ll do it?

Interesting about the vitamin side, I always thought your body could only absorb so much so if you took too much you just pee it out! Didn’t think you could overdose.
 
I think if there’s sperm issues they don’t want to risk the eggs not fertilising. In my ivf pack (from the nhs) they say 50-70% of eggs fertilise if everything goes well, but it can range between 0-100%. If they know there’s sperm issues they can select the best ones and do Icsi to force fertilisation. The last thing you’d want is to go through ivf and fall at that stage. I’ve just gone through ivf and only 4 of my 13 eggs fertilised. Hubby’s sperm are fine, but if in theory they weren’t and we did ivf we might not have had any embryos.

But I think Icsi might be more expensive since it’s more resource intensive.
Hope you don’t have to go through either though, so long as he has sperm there’s always a chance for you to fall pregnant naturally
 
Gosh it is expensive isn’t it..

We had a quick look last night on some sites of the clinics around us and it’s scary. We could have enough saved in 5 or 6 months depending on how kind life is to us but it’s no guarantee it would work and after 2 failed nhs cycles is it worth spending so much money.. on. It is depressing!!

I know some people go abroad for ivf as it’s much cheaper. Wouldn’t know where to start looking though!

Feel the exact same as you Millie. Were lucky that we have the money to do ivf privately, but there’s no guarantee and the odds are so low. If it doesn’t work you get the devastation all over again and empty pockets! And if it doesn’t work where do you go from there? I can see why women get addicted to ivf, it’s hard not to think ‘maybe one more try’.

I always questioned whether abroad would work out cheaper, the treatment cost definitely is but all the travelling and hotel costs plus the time off work? I wouldn’t know where to look and if the distance just negates the savings you’d make.
 
Hi hun,
I’m in the same boat having to pay for ivf, pay as you go ivf is extortionate if you need more than one cycle which often people do. look into access fertility, that is the refund people, it makes it more expensive and is subject to a medical review but you can’t get it if you have certain conditions.

But they also do a ‘multi cycle’ which is the option we are going for, this is two fresh cycles of ivf and unlimited free frozen cycles for any eggs that are collected. This costs 6800 at my clinic plus meds but that’s without ICSI. My sister needs ICSI and I think hers is about 7500 for the same thing.

If you look at hfea website you can see how expensive a certain clinic is compared to others, we are travelling over an hour to go to our clinic because it gets above average results but competitive fees x
 
im probably seeing too much into it bu why has it got to be ICSI for us? she says its just the way it is when sperm issues but why!? it is really that low of a chance otherwise? and if its low there is it borderline impossible for natural then?? mind blowing :( its so flipping depressing.. UNLESS they do ICSI because ya know.. people have paid and they wanna get as good success rate as pos & more chance that with ICSI? no idea.. :( i know prices above are for 35 and under and tho expensive in my case they seem to include a lot of extras you'd pay for on top normally so.. freezing, transfer etc.

I would think it’s because they would want to give you the best chance success. And I agree with CDK as long as there’s sperm you still have a chance naturally. Hopefully the vitamins/supplements will make improvements soon. It can just take time.

I always wish my nhs clinic would have agreed to do ICSI or long protocol on the second round but nope literally felt like they just wanted me in and out.. off of the nhs’s hands as quick and cheap as possible sometimes!! I would have loved a higher chance at some frozen embryos. I know I shouldn’t really complain though as some areas do get no free cycles.
 
Sophie - i don't think it is impossible for you to conceive naturally.
It is good that you have been told to stop some of the supplements and now you can get into the routine of taking the supplements the nurse has suggested you will hopefully see an improvement.
I personally think you should give it another couple of months with the changed routine and get your OH to have another S/A and if it still hasn't improved then look into IVF.
It is very expensive if you are going privately and i truly believe you will be able to conceive naturally. x
 
I think if there’s sperm issues they don’t want to risk the eggs not fertilising. In my ivf pack (from the nhs) they say 50-70% of eggs fertilise if everything goes well, but it can range between 0-100%. If they know there’s sperm issues they can select the best ones and do Icsi to force fertilisation. The last thing you’d want is to go through ivf and fall at that stage. I’ve just gone through ivf and only 4 of my 13 eggs fertilised. Hubby’s sperm are fine, but if in theory they weren’t and we did ivf we might not have had any embryos.

But I think Icsi might be more expensive since it’s more resource intensive.
Hope you don’t have to go through either though, so long as he has sperm there’s always a chance for you to fall pregnant naturally

hi thanks for your reply.. she said ICSI has to be the way as 0 can fertilise as you said.. :)
i had 5k in my head and it is normally when sat in a dish for 16hrs as she put it.. i think they would want ICSI for their success rates as much as ours. 2 at £10,300 isnt awful in hindsight essentially £5k a cycle but still a shock for some reason.. we will have to save some more.. i REALLY wanted to get IVF done :(
 
It is expensive isn’t it, I hadn’t looked into fees before but always heard it was about £5k so just had that in my head. Do you think you’ll do it?

Interesting about the vitamin side, I always thought your body could only absorb so much so if you took too much you just pee it out! Didn’t think you could overdose.

re: vitamins.. she said to me that basically if your body says youve got enough it just gets rid of it so basically its money down the toilet is how she put it.. she gave me that website which is excellent to be honest.. i read coq10 is brilliant for men with vericocle (he has this) so looks like he will be going on coq10 long term..! selenium she said 100mcg hes on 200mcg on single supplement + theirs some in wellmans so we will probably have to drop the extra one but i gotta do some math and stuff on how many mcg of selenium is in wellmans first..
 
these are the ones i have spoken with! haha. yes the £10,300 is a multicycle (2) programme with a 50% refund if fails

Much cheaper if you don’t go with the refund option and no medical review, that’s why we went for the multicycle with no refund x
 
Much cheaper if you don’t go with the refund option and no medical review, that’s why we went for the multicycle with no refund x

she didnt offer me this over the phone she's just there to talk to me about fertility in general and the process of ivf. it sounded so scary i dunno just terrifies me, i'd defo talk with doctor about no refund then see what he/she says! :)
 
Much cheaper if you don’t go with the refund option and no medical review, that’s why we went for the multicycle with no refund x

sugar how did yours work out? have you paid for it? how much was yours if you dont mind me asking and are you able to do the IVF or ICSI? she said they would want their own sperm test since hubbys is so random- but i dont need any at all - once ive had my scan tomorrow as long as i have results of them and a valid AMH they are happy with me.
she said my drugs would be £1000 each cycle..
to add the quote she gave me includes all the freezing and transfer and other small things in it that would normally cost extra as she put it..
 
Sophie - i don't think it is impossible for you to conceive naturally.
It is good that you have been told to stop some of the supplements and now you can get into the routine of taking the supplements the nurse has suggested you will hopefully see an improvement.
I personally think you should give it another couple of months with the changed routine and get your OH to have another S/A and if it still hasn't improved then look into IVF.
It is very expensive if you are going privately and i truly believe you will be able to conceive naturally. x

it just felt to me like.. why do i need such forceful fertilisation ya know!? but i was thinking again and maybe its because the success rate will be better. i think its the way she put it, where she said any sperm issues and they can sit in a dish for 16hrs and do nothing.. made me think, if thats true i have literally 0 chance of ever conceiving naturally cause jeez!!
the website she gave me was excellent. i forgot to mention he had vericocle. i dont know how i even forgot! but on one article it mentions how coq10 is used in men with vericocle so fantastic defo adding it for him!!!! :) just no more black maca or ashwagandha it seems and looking at cutting selenium or doing math on it and need to do math on vit c as well as she said to be careful as it can go from helpful to harmful in higher doses.
 
sugar how did yours work out? have you paid for it? how much was yours if you dont mind me asking and are you able to do the IVF or ICSI? she said they would want their own sperm test since hubbys is so random- but i dont need any at all - once ive had my scan tomorrow as long as i have results of them and a valid AMH they are happy with me.
she said my drugs would be £1000 each cycle..
to add the quote she gave me includes all the freezing and transfer and other small things in it that would normally cost extra as she put it..

Of course I don’t mind, it’s a mind field. We haven’t come started ivf yet as still saving and we got our consultation free as formed part of the follow up appointment for the ovulation induction.
We paid £200 for AMH blood test
They accepted our SA as less than 12 months old from the gp and we just had the results printed.
We will need the hep blood tests etc that I think they said are about £200
The ivf we are paying for is £6800, this is for the ivf, scans, freezing and transfer. This will give us two ‘fresh’ cycles of ivf but we will also get free FETs for any embryos collected and frozen as part of our fresh cycles.
This is just ivf not icsi as our problem is me and my pcos not dh.
Drugs not included so about £1000 a cycle.

I hope that makes sense xx
 
it just felt to me like.. why do i need such forceful fertilisation ya know!? but i was thinking again and maybe its because the success rate will be better. i think its the way she put it, where she said any sperm issues and they can sit in a dish for 16hrs and do nothing.. made me think, if thats true i have literally 0 chance of ever conceiving naturally cause jeez!!
the website she gave me was excellent. i forgot to mention he had vericocle. i dont know how i even forgot! but on one article it mentions how coq10 is used in men with vericocle so fantastic defo adding it for him!!!! :) just no more black maca or ashwagandha it seems and looking at cutting selenium or doing math on it and need to do math on vit c as well as she said to be careful as it can go from helpful to harmful in higher doses.

If there is a sperm issue I would always opt for icsi, I wouldn’t want to risk not fertilising or having so few fertilise you don’t get to freeze any. You spend too much as it is to risk that.
 
Of course I don’t mind, it’s a mind field. We haven’t come started ivf yet as still saving and we got our consultation free as formed part of the follow up appointment for the ovulation induction.
We paid £200 for AMH blood test
They accepted our SA as less than 12 months old from the gp and we just had the results printed.
We will need the hep blood tests etc that I think they said are about £200
The ivf we are paying for is £6800, this is for the ivf, scans, freezing and transfer. This will give us two ‘fresh’ cycles of ivf but we will also get free FETs for any embryos collected and frozen as part of our fresh cycles.
This is just ivf not icsi as our problem is me and my pcos not dh.
Drugs not included so about £1000 a cycle.

I hope that makes sense xx

wow thats so cheap! even for natural ivf ours want £4000 for 1 cycle i believe!? did you go thru accessfertility? if we do end up going for it properly then i will ask about price difference with no refund vs a refund. i cant see this online but they are sending me a booklet.
 

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